49 comments

  1. The best thing about tonight is going to be watching both Steve Alford’s and Pat Knight’s teams lose to unranked opponents.

  2. ^ New Mexico too is down 40 – 28 at the half. At home but there’s a second half and they’re at home. Texas Texh has made it a one possession game with 28 seconds still on the clock.

  3. Texas Tech lost (83-85) and there’s no excuse but I still want to point out how they rallied from being 21-35 at halftime. I bet Pat Knight had Stanford’s football coach give the players a speech at halftime… ahem… wait!… no, that’s Tom Crean’s strategy, sorry. My bad.

  4. FINAL: IU 81, NCCU 58.
    IU: Creek 29, 7reb; Watford 11; Pritchard 8; Elston 7; Jones 7; Hulls 5, 7reb, 8ast; Dumes 4; Rivers 3, 8ast; Jobe 2; Capobiano 2; Moore 2; Muniru 1.
    IU: 30-59 (51%) FG; 7-23 3PT; 14-21 FT; 44 reb; 16 TO; 9 (16) fouls.
    NCCU: 21-62 (34%) FG; 6-20 3PT; 10-15 FT; 26 reb; 8 TO; 9 (20) fouls.
    NCCU: Wilkerson 22; Sims 11, 6reb; Chasten 6; Glasker 5; Manns 5; Worthy 4; Granger 3, 6reb; Sapara 2.

  5. Ken Pomeroy had Texas Tech losing to Wichita St. 67-70 (it ended 83-85 after Texas Tech went down 21-35 at halftime but crawled back to a 61-57 late
    in the second half).

    kenpom’s New Mexico prediction wasn’t as accurate: it predicted a 91-69 win for the Lobos. Game ended just now, but it was much closer: 66-61 for Steve Alford’s team who went 28-40 in the first half, and 38-21 in the second.

    Finally kenpom had Indiana winning tonight 88-65.

  6. Why would any REAL Hoosier fan, come on a Hoosier basketball blog like this, and wish failure on a former Hoosier great who played a huge role in hanging one of those banners that we all(?) cherish in the Hall?

    Oh, I guess I’m making some assumptions huh?

    Good Luck to Steve and Pat both (until they play IU).
    I hope they both have great years!

    Go Hoosiers!

  7. kenpom’s projected record for New Mexico was (at the start of the season) 28-3 with 2 of of 3 losses coming from California and Texas A&M. So New Mexico was indeed expected to have a good record, just not to be undefeated at this point. Therefore Steve Alford deserves praise for keeping them undefeated, no matter how you look at it.

    Texas Tech’s projected record was 19-11 with the first of these 11 losses projected for tonight against Wichita St. (and it happened). So from this point of view Pat Knight’s record thus far isn’t as impressive as Alford’s. In fact for Pat Knight things are currently exactly as expected (cf. kenpom). Texas Tech will play New Mexico on 12/29 in Albuquerque. A ten point win for New Mexico is kenpom’s prediction (82-71, actually).

    So my point is that Steve Alford’s season is better so far than Pat Knight’s. Was so before tonight’s games. Continues to be so after the games. Meanwhile, to get back to the Hoosiers, kenpom had Michigan lose by 30 today to Kansas (85-55); the game finished 75-64.

  8. Big Comeback win for Steve Alford and New Mexico who now sit at 12-0. Great coaching job Steve.
    Pat Knight had a tough road loss by 2 points to a team who is undefeated at home. He now sits at 9-1

  9. Let me add one thing: Crean’s Hoosiers have a projected record of 10-20 on kenpom. Since we’re using the exact same instrument (kenpom) for all three coaches and teams (Texas Tech, New Mexico and Indiana) we’re not comparing apples with oranges. The Hoosiers were supposed to be 10-20 at the end of the season, with 16 losses yet to happen. This means Crean’s team is underperforming. No excuses about age, leadership, or anything else can be invoked since all of that has already been taken into account when kenpom calculated the predictions. Thus Tom Crean’s team is simply one game below expectations.

    To summarize:

    1. New Mexico (Steve Alford) is 12-0, was expected to be 10-2, Steve Alford and his team deserve praise for exceeding expectations thus far.

    2. Texas Tech (Pat Knight) is 9-1, was expected to be 9-1, nothing abnormal here either way.

    3. Indiana Hoosiers (Tom Crean) is 5-5, was expected to be 6-4 though, hence Tom Crean’s team is underperforming. Again.

    I hope this clarifies that so far, this season, Tom Crean is a distant third when compared with Steve Alford and Pat Knight. If the Creanophiles don’t see the light now they will never see it. Of course, I am aware of the fact that as the season progresses things might change. But so far those who kept insulting the blogger stevealford nearly every time would do well to try to regain awareness of their Hoosier roots by reading or rereading this book. Makes a good Christmas present for all 25 year olds and younger.

  10. ^ Yet another deep contribution to this blog by the one and only GooFyDave. GooFyDave, sometimes I need what only you can provide: your absence.

  11. seriously what the F are all you guys complaining about Tom Crean for. and comparing him to coaches that have done WHAT?!?!?!? WHAT HAS PAT KNIGHT AND STEVE ALFORD DONE. JACK F-ING $H*T. SO STOP BEING IU HATERS and support your God Damn School!!!!!! who the F*** cares about what ONE single man says about college basketball. WHAT DOES HE AND HIS COMPUTERIZED STATS HAVE THAT BRAINWASH ALL OF YOU! Pat Knight inherited his DAD’S team. Steve Alford inherited a team with a FIRST ROUND NBA DRAFT PICK!! what did Crean Inherit?!? Kyle TAber! Use your own brain and not some nut job putting together useless stats to make money.

  12. Tom Crean also inherited a first round NBA draft pick (Eric Gordon) but could not, or did not want to try to keep him here. He also inherited all the Sampson players but he sent them all away. He didn’t try to keep anyone except Kyle Taber. He could have tried to at least keep Jordan Crawford or Eli Holman. He did not. Now he regrets not having Holman (see what was reported on this blog after the game with Kentucky, and what Crean said as quoted in the post entitled “Crean: We don’t want sumo wrestlers”)

    As for the numbers on kenpom’s site it’s clear you reject what you don’t understand. I support my school and I think this coach should do better and be held accountable for how the program develops or we need a better coach. IU is one thing and Tom Crean is another. Pat Knight and Steve Alford are former Hoosiers and currently better at coaching than this guy who got a 2 million extension here at IU without coaching a single game.

  13. dougy, your opinion is strictly that and no one on here but steve alford accepts it. Yes Crawford and Holman would have helped but they had a choice in the decision too. Rant all you want but Tom Crean is the coach and all your hot air won’t change it.

  14. Having our opinions on who should be coach is fine, but let’s consider a few things.

    1.) You can’t claim to want a coach like Knight or Alford (for the reason of having a real “Hoosier” at the helm; for the purpose of representing the tradition and a greater understanding of IU basketball), and then at the same time criticize Crean for not keeping Holman. Let’s remember that this was a kid who was suspended for one season of high school ball for shoving a referee. This is a kid who had the cops called on him during a meeting with Crean because he couldn’t control his temper. IU basketball was built recruiting players with character and an understanding of the values of the school. It doesn’t make much sense to call for a coach with a better understanding of the IU way to replace Crean, and at the same time criticize our current coach for acting under those same principles. Had Crean retained Holman, he would’ve been going against the the Indiana way of doing things that he’s clearly trying to restore.

    2.) I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again — my problem (the problem) with stevealford’s general comments is that they are ironically the source of undue animosity on this site towards Alford and Knight. People like Crean. When you leverage the (early season) success of those coaches against our coach whom most people like, you’re going to get some backlash that ends up resulting in perhaps unfair harsh criticisms of two people heavily involved in the successes of IU in the past. It’s just unfortunate.

    3.) Neither Knight, nor Alford will be the IU coach any time soon, so perhaps we should begin to steer the discussion elsewhere for a while. It’s great that both coaches are doing well at other schools, but that’s where they’ll remain. Let’s just be happy for them and try to keep level heads when it comes to judging our IU team and our coach in the still early stages of this restoration process.

  15. kenpom said that it would snow 3 inches last night, and we only got a trace.

    kenpom said that John McCain would win Indiana.

    kenpom said to sell your Microsoft stocks back in 88.

  16. I have never said anything that would cause backlash against Steve Alford or Pat Knight. There are 2 great men who mean a lot to IU. I simply state facts about how well they are doing and people take offense because Crean can’t have us playing in the same league as these schools who have such fewer advantages.

  17. Since kenpom has these predictions mapped out so well, then why does anyone even bother to play the game? Predictions are just that. They mean nothing except for the bookies and the people who ruin the purity of athletic competition by betting on them.

  18. Actually, I never predicted team records at the start of the season. There was no information regarding the 2009-2010 Division I teams to make any projections at that time. Projections of potential game outcomes have only been added to the site this past week. Just wanted to clarify an apparent misrepresentation.

  19. These predictions simply reflect our understanding of the game at the start of the competition. That understanding is imperfect as everything else is, but at least it is uniform and unbiased towards a specific school or coach. So we can use it to compare across programs in a more objective and quantitative manner.

    Furthermore a prediction can be in principle perfect yet fail to materialize because those involved underperform or overperform — because we make mistakes or improve our game. kenpom never said anynthing about McCain, Microsoft, or inches of snow but correctly predicted the games last night (so: shame on you Husky).

    I only tried to substantiate stevealford’s claims from a certain point view that (as far as I can tell) had not been taken by anyone before. Of course, for bringing up kenpom in the first place I need to thank Dustin Dopirak. I tried to be as logical as possible, but I am aware of some of the shortcomings of my argument. Yet I didn’t want to be told again: “you’re trying to have it both ways”.

    Anyway I enjoyed this but I’m going to give it a rest now. I’ll be back here after the Wolverines game on New Year’s Eve. Best wishes to everybody and a happy holiday season to all.

  20. Man! If team records were added only last week and Indiana is listed at 10-20 then why are there 21 losses listed in the Hoosier schedule? What is the basis for the projected 20 losses: did kenpom really think that Indiana would beat Kentucky, but we didn’t, hence the extra loss?

    The only misrepresentation is that the poster signs as kenpom. Instead the blogger could just think — as hard and unattractive as this may sound. Posting some inconsistent, obviosly fake message and signing kenpom is misleading on purpose. A lie never lives to be old.

    ๐Ÿ˜•

  21. alford i can understand being a “Great” man to IU, but what did Pat do? He would never had made the team had his dad not been Bob, and he was a career pine rider. So really, where are you pulling this crap from? I know pat personally, and I like him from middle and high school, but he doesnt belong in the same category as Alford who brough IU glory in the 80’s The comparisons to Crean are retarded. Crean is a great coach, has the resume, and will continue to build on it. If he cant in 4 years, then ill agree hes not as good as advertised

  22. … but what did Pat do? […] So really, where are you pulling this crap from?

    ak47:

    He didn’t do much as a player (although some disagree at 1:57, fighting tears). As a coach, who knows, maybe one day… He certainly has the pedigree, as you say.

  23. Lemony/L’accent: Give me a break. You and stevealford sit back and try to pass yourselves off as mere “objective observers” who are simply trying to “state innocent facts and observations.”

    You are on record as saying “we are stuck with Crean.”

    Alford is on record as saying “This guy [Crean] is a fraud.”

    Shame on the both of you for trying to convince us that you are only playing the impartial observesr. You both are obviously biased against the coach. Why not give up on your pathetic attempts to hide under arguments like “I am just praising two men [Alfie and Patty] who meant a lot to IU.”?

    You aren’t only cozying up to venerable figures of Hoosier lore. You are using it as a pretext to criticize a guy who came to this school with a .666 winning percentage in nearly 300 career D1 NCAA games. These numbers deserve some respect, don’t they? At leas for a few seasons?

  24. with a .666 winning pe

    Doesn’t this number scare you at all? ๐Ÿ˜€

    I’m not biased against the coach, I expect and demand more of him. Shame on you for expecting and demanding so much less and shame on you for writing that you enjoy seeing Alford’s and Knight’s teams lose, then calling them “venerable”. (Haven’t you heard: what do you even call Pat Knight venerable for?)

  25. I did call Crean a fraud because outside of 1 year with D Wade he has only won 1 NCAA tournament game.
    You talk so much about his resume, but his resume sucks!

  26. Sybil, the overbearing nature of your presence is only surpassed by your ego. Only in your own mind are your vapid and nonsensical ramblings entertaining, topical and creative in your own mind. I have a suggestion: I’ll stay and you go.

    I’m not going to take your crap.

  27. stevealford- the “outside of Wade” argument is the stupidest argument of all time. You might as well demerit Tony Dungy for only winning with Manning, Walsh for only winning with Montana, and Pat Riley for only winning with Magic (and …Wade).

    And to ‘respect’/L’accent/Lemony/Korman or friend of Korman: thank you for holding the world accountable and for having such strong expectations for all those who touch your lives. You sincerely make this world a better place, and make us more honorable men. The university needs to build a statue in front of Sample Gates as a thank you to your integrity and fatherly virtue.

  28. Washingon Apple: leave Korman out of this, please.

    GFDave: ๐Ÿ˜€ There are so many ways to relieve stress, anxiety and other emotional buildups. For example — have you considered crying? “Crying is a great form of stress relief when you really let it out.” Give it a try!

  29. Washington Apple,
    That was a stupid comparison because all of those guys had more than one good year. You just don’t “get it”. That would be a valid point if Pat Riley had Magic one year and then every other year in his career he won one playoff game.

  30. Washington Babble: fool me once — shame on you. Fool me twice… shame on — you can’t fool me again!

    GFDave: ๐Ÿ˜€ Let it all out, man. Turn on the waterworks! “Researchers suggest that crying is so beneficial that there may be a case for inducing crying in those who find it difficult to let go. Sure there are other ways to relief stress naturally; exercise, sex, sleep, massage, baths, but donโ€™t deprive yourself of a good cry.” (cf. Tears for Fears)

  31. stevealfordAruss- Was Dungy a bad comparison? Please address this point. I am afraid you are starting to sound like GooFyDave and ________, buddy.

    By the way, does Crean not deserve credit for recruiting and developing Wade, you ignoramus? You said yourself that Creek is a stud. Was Creek delivered by the stork? Or was a certain coach responsible for recruiting him?

  32. ———-.:

    My name is not ________, my name is __________. OK? That’s one very important thing. Every single character is important. Next time please be more careful — you don’t just go around and mutilate people’s names! What if I were to call you ———- (without the .) or even worse: —. How would you like that? Not funny.

    Also I liked the “Was Creek delivered by the stork?” figure of speech but it is well known that Creek came to Bloomington exclusively for Downing’s 5th (who first compared him with Oscar Palmer Robertson, shoulder dip and everything.)

  33. Dungy has 5 years in his career where he has won playoff games. That is called consistency. Crean does not deserve much credit recruiting Wade, He didn’t have the grades to go anywhere good or he would have.

  34. I am beginning to think that Hoosiers are pathetic in general, Kevin K.

    They defend a coach who can’t win more than 1 Big 10 football game season after season, and they chastise a coach who brings us Maurice Creek, Christian Watford, and 196 career wins.

  35. ^ where that to be so it may have something to do with everything being relative. 1 big10 win every season is pretty normal for iu football. 196 career wins are about the size of the picnic goers on this dog’s head for the basketball program here: Sampson had 400+ when he came here, Bob Knight had 600+ when he left. Mike Davis had 46 career victories in his first two seasons: the most-ever by an IU coach in his first two seasons (for those who are gettin ready to tell me he got Bob Knight’s team: Bob Knight had 43 wins in the two years before!) So the expectations are so much more different.

  36. Wow, I am gone for a weekend and this is what happens.

    I only have one question from all of this.

    stevealford,
    How do you defend Alford’s record at Iowa (where he had a bunch of good players), and where he left it for the last couple of years?
    Please and Thanks.

  37. correction: [were] that to happen …

    i too want to hear a defense of steve alford’s record at iowa but it could be that the record can’t be defended. he may have been a bad coach, or he may have made rookie mistakes that snowballed into him losing control and eventually failing.

    my perception is that stevealford claims the real steve alford is currently a better coach than tom crean. mental experiment: would the lobos still be 12-0 now if they had started the season with tom crean (or if tom crean had signed with them in 2007 instead)?

    did marquette ever have such a season start? i am asking because i don’t know, i am not saying that they never have.

  38. jubilee,
    The Iowa program was five times as good during Alford’s tenure than Lickliter has it. Alford was winning multiple big ten championships (tournament). Iowa does not have near the advantages that a coach at IU has. He took SW Missouri St to the sweet 16 with a bunch of nobody’s. CURRENTLY he is 12-0.

  39. I understand he had some successful years in there, but he accepted a good program and left it in shambles for Lickliter.

    Crean accepted a below average program in marquette and built it up to a team that competes year-in-year out in the big east.

    He has now taken indiana from a team that had 2 walk-on’s and 0 recruits in april and still won 6 games the next year…even beating Iowa.

    Now in his second year, he is 5-5 (7-5) going into the big 10. Also, his teams at IU have only gotten better during the season.

    I know you are a die-hard Steve Alford guy, and I loved him as a player. In Indiana’s situation though, we don’t need a coach to come in and continue on winning ways using someone elses players, but someone who will come in and build something from the ground up. Which Crean has proven at a major conference, not a mid major.

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