Hoosiers offer scholarship to 2015 PG Austin Conway

As of April, Austin Conway was fairly certain that football would be the sport he’d eventually play in college and possibly beyond.

Granted, he’s 15 and that’s just a tad early to determine whether or not a young man has a future in such a brutal sport, but he has genetics on his side. His father Earl was high school quarterback before becoming a star defensive tackle at Division II Mississippi College and spent short stints with both the Denver Broncos and the Seattle Seahawks in the NFL. His older brother also played the game in college, and Austin was a starting quarterback and defensive back at Overland High School in Aurora, Colo., as a freshman.

But since opening eyes at the Adidas Invite Run in Las Vegas in April, he’s started to realize that his future might actually be as a point guard. Tom Crean apparently thinks so too. After honing in on the 5-foot-9 Conway beginning with the Adidas Invitational last month in Indianapolis, the Hoosiers offered the Class of 2015 recruit a scholarship on Tuesday. The Hoosiers previously offered De’Ron Davis, Conway’s 6-foot-9 travel squad teammate with the Colorado Hawks.

Hawks coach Art Williams can’t say for certain whether or not Conway will eventually take the Hoosiers’ offer. Indiana was the first to come forward with a scholarship, but western schools such as Arizona and Colorado have shown interest and Conway expects to attend a camp at Arkansas later this month.

However, Williams does believe Conway is starting to realize he belongs on the hardwood.

“He’s a really gifted athlete,” said Williams, who confirmed Indiana’s offer. “But I think he really sees he has an ability to accomplish a lot more on the basketball court.”

That appeared obvious at the Adidas Invitational where he and Conway reached the 15 and under championship game before falling to the Eric Gordon Central Stars. During the Hawks’ run Conway and the Hawks defeated what had been a dominant Indiana Elite squad which included IU target Hyron Edwards. Edwards was held scoreless in that game while Conway scored 24 points. Conway showed astounding speed and quickness in those games as well as strength beyond his diminutive height.

At least that’s what Indiana noticed.

“They really like how fast the kid is,” Williams said. “They like the way he handles the ball, how strong he is, how court smart he is. They think his upside is really good, and I agree.”

Though Conway may be leaning toward basketball, Williams said another one of his strengths is a mentality that comes from being a quarterback.

“He has an amazing work ethic,” Williams said. “He has the sort of work ethic that would allow him to go on a college campus right now and compete. … And Austin is just a leader. He steps on the court and demands the attention of his teammates.”

The next step for Conway, Williams said, is for him to become more well-rounded as a scorer. As it stands, he appears to have an innate understanding of how to affect the speed of the game, when to push the ball and when to slow it down into a half-court setting and facilitate. He also has the athleticism and strength to get to the rim just about any time he wants.

But at some point — especially because he’s 5-9 — he won’t be able to do all of that on athleticism. Conway hit some jumpers this July, but Williams said he still needs to be better from the perimeter.

“If he can develop that,” Williams said, “it will be really hard to guard him.”

62 comments

  1. Is our program at a point where we don’t have to make offers to kids who are so young? I would think being #1 again we could let prospects develop then pick and choose because we are an elite program again.

    The only early offers I’d like to see us make from this point forward are kids with good bloodlines like Gordon and Blackmon or tall genetic freaks.

  2. Spotting talented players with character and the will to work hard to improve early is Crean’s “edge”. Don’t expect this to end any time soon.

  3. I’m not in the coaches’ office so I have no idea if this is even close to being right but it seems as if CTC is more hands on in player assessment than some of his contemporaries who leave more of that to the recruiting coordinator. I’m in ACC country and when I read a story about a college coach being in a gym to see a high school player it’s usually an assistant coach. With IU it seems like CTC is talking to these guys personally. These kids seem to always talk about their relationship to CTC as opposed to an assistant. My point being, maybe he feels a little more confident about a kid because he seen and spoken to him personally.

  4. It is his style, I like it and it has much to do with his amazing success. Many people have had some hand in the climb back but Coach Crean is the lead. I do imagine McClain, Buckley and Johnson(maybe Calbert)do some of the peripheral scouting that brings research on recruits to Crean’s attention but he does the evaluating.

  5. Calbert can’t do peripheral scouting anymore (he was allowed by NCAA rule while there was an assistant coaching vacancy, but not since Johnson was hired) but all three assistants are very involved in the evaluation. I’m sure Crean doesn’t allow his assistants to make an offer before he gets a chance to evaluate them, but I can tell you that McClain was on top of both of these Colorado Hawks kids in Indianapolis. Crean says his staff is one that does a lot of cross-checking. In some cases, one assistant might have more of a connection to a recruit than others, but generally, Crean does his best to make certain that all of his assistants evaluate all of his recruits.

  6. Aruss,
    It should be pointed out that for all the talk of IU being No. 1, there hasn’t been an official preseason poll released yet, that Indiana hasn’t actually won a national title since 1987 and that the Hoosiers have been to just one Final Four in the lifetimes of their current recruits. They are in very, very good shape right now, but until they win another title, they can’t wait for recruits to come to them.

  7. “…that the Hoosiers have been to just one Final Four in the lifetimes of their current recruits.”

    Even so, I would suppose that the mathematical odds of that happening show pretty good odds. Consider those same odds for other Big Ten schools, etc. And, given the hole IU had to dig itself out of due to Sampson’s cellular mania, (at Oklahoma first and inherited by Indiana through bad administrative decisions; how deeply it was dug by the NCAA (no question it was deserved at the time, under those rules) only to dismiss the entire issue immediately after Indiana served out its sanctions); and the genuine appeal of the “It’s Indiana” legend to restore the Hoosiers to their culture of success, ‘doing things the right way’ and to its just as deserved prominence certainly merits acknowledgment.

    I don’t believe any program in the Big Ten compares in terms of its basketball history. Some have at times approached the standards but their achievements are still measured in terms of the Hoosier’s history.

    Hopefully, another successful season will return the Hoosiers to where its fans can enjoy and celebrate its well reputation without buckets of ice to tone down its generally admirable consistency.

  8. Come on, Dustin.

    We defeated two of the best teams in the nation last season…The only college sports story exceeding the notoriety of the Indiana Hoosiers return to prominence, the symbolic glory of Watford’s game-winner against UK in a nationally televised game, was the ugly ongoing proceedings and permanent memory stain of the despicable last 15 years that went on in a Penn State football locker room.

    The Hoosiers followed up a memorable regular season, put to rest even more doubts, with an unexpected run to the Sweet 16; all occurring in the face of every blowhard expert in the country predicting the Hoosiers to be an early exit(against NMS and, subsequently, VCU).

    You’re sounding like Seth Davis with all the hedging of the bet and seemingly hopeful doubts. You can be assured that Zeller will stay until that 6th banner serves to rub all the entrenched “Eastern media establishment”/IU-haters in the face. Relax and enjoy.

  9. Oy, before this gets out of hand, obviously Tom Crean agrees with me based on his recruiting methods. Indiana has obviously accomplished a lot in the last year and I’m not disputing the significance of that accomplishment. What I’m saying — and what Crean obviously knows — is that Indiana hasn’t reached the point that it can hustle any less in recruiting than other schools. Now, IU can obviously get any recruit to answer its phone calls and to listen. It’s a program that has appeal to every recruit in the country. But IU isn’t at a point where it can string Top 50 players along and make them wait until their senior year for an offer like North Carolina and Duke can. (There’s another school that can that I won’t mention because I don’t want to go there. Plus, that’s probably burned North Carolina and Duke anyway.) I’m not saying Indiana hasn’t put itself in a position to be able to recruit and get top level talent. I’m just saying that if IU hasn’t started recruiting somebody like Jabbari Parker yet, the Hoosiers can’t call tomorrow with an offer and expect to get him. This is not an insult, because even Tom Crean would not dispute this.

  10. I agree with Dustin’s points. What bothers me is the kid is 5’9″ and he played defensive back. Defensive backs are generally very small and not knowing how tall his dad is I’m not sure the kid is done growing. You read the stories about kids getting offers in 8th grade and freshman like at USC and Kentucky back in the day because they dominated their age group at the time because they hit their growth spurt early then never developed.

    I just think we should hold off on those early offers for special circumstances. I figure after this year’s undefeated national championship we can change up our recruiting tactics (don’t be a wet blanket, Dustin.).

  11. Bob Knight didn’t have the best players in the country. It’s irrelevant. We can get to Final Fours with the type of recruit now giving Indiana serious consideration. There will always be impediments(schools willing to recruit and take bigger gambles on students with questionable academics, etc), but Indiana is plenty rebuilt to get an abundance of opportunities to land top recruits(especially some of the top homegrown talent that Duke, NC, and OSU have plucked from the Hoosier state with more and more frequency the last 10 years). Name a top big man that was playing in NC that came to IU during Knight’s heyday? For the last 15-20 years we’ve lost nearly every legit top big man from our borders to a local Big 10 rival or a team in NC. Where are those teams trips to the Final Fours without those Indiana kids? Tell me where the Plumlees and Cody’s brothers took their talent. Tell me where Scott May’s son attended school? Tell me where Luke Harangody went? Tell me where Greg Oden and Mike Conley helped establish a bit of a recruiting tidal wave in 2007 for an ex-Butler coach?

    Crean has finally stopped the bleeding. Will we get every top 8th grader in the country wanting to consider Bloomington? Of course not. Knight never won championships with five lottery picks on his team. Did Butler get to back-to-back Final Fours with a Kentucky roster? I would argue we have more talent looking at Indiana then in the history of the program. Are you not confident that Crean can take that talent and develop it with the same success someone like Coach K at Duke or Brad Stevens at Butler? Now that’s an entirely different subject. Do you think much of Crean’s anger vented at Seth Davis upon the immediate conclusion of the VCU game was possibly due to the fact he thought they were doubting his coaching just as much as the level talent and athleticism on the roster?

    Sit back, relax, and enjoy, Mr. Eastern Establishment Doubter. We have hired a salesman like no other. He’s ruthless and will oversign recruits no matter what some pimple on his butt journalist wants to write about the horrible unethicalness of the practice. He’s young. He wants to play the game at an NBA pace. Mix premium homegrown talent into the equation of our new attractiveness to many top 20 players outside our borders…? You ain’t seen nothin’ yet. We may win five titles in the next 10 years. Why do you think Kartje and Kellenberger blew town..? The thought of that type of success at McCracken turned their bloated stomachs and shoved the indigestion squally against their envious broken hearts.

  12. …we have more talent looking at Indiana than any other time period in the history of the program.

  13. And I don’t care if the Conway kid’s stature makes him eligible to be named Snow White’s “Flashy” 8th Dwarf…If Crean thinks he’s a promising point guard, then I’m trusting his judgment.

    Keep ’em coming….Recruit them from their mommy’s womb for all I care.

  14. Knight had more McDonald All-Americans than anyone but Dean Smith at the time so it’s a myth to say, “He won with nobodies” like his apologists always say.

  15. Ah, Harvard. The Eastern Establishment Conspiracy Theory shall never die.
    Aruss, his dad was apparently 6-5, 270 pounds. I won’t act like I know Conway is going to be 6-5, but he will probably be taller and he’s really, really quick. And don’t forget, Yogi Ferrell is 5-11.

  16. Dustin-

    Sit back, relax, and enjoy…..watching Seth Davis, Kartje, Kellenberger, Korman, and the rest your idols of the hating-on-IU Establishment fester in the muck their envy. Rejoice! You have made wise choice! You have stayed for the party! My only wish is that you keep their cynicism, negative energy, and jealous asses off of LiveDiscussion during games.

    __________________________

    Festering Pus-filled Boil(ermaker)-

    Obviously subjective, but take a look at the Top McDonald’s All-American Classes from this crop.

    Knight did land about one McDonald’s All-American per year, but other than Isiah Thomas, most were not the cream of the crop. I will definitely agree with you that he inherited some fabulous recruits(Downing and McGinnis)when he arrived at IU. Nothing like getting a jump start.

    Tom Baker – 1977
    Ray Tolbert – 1977
    Landon Turner – 1978
    Isiah Thomas – 1979
    John Flowers – 1981
    Daryl Thomas – 1983
    Delray Brooks – 1984(transferred)
    Ricky Calloway – 1985
    Jay Edwards – 1987
    Eric Anderson – 1988
    Greg Graham – 1989
    Pat Graham – 1989
    Damon Bailey – 1990
    Alan Henderson – 1991
    Sherron Wilkerson – 1993
    Andrae Patterson – 1994
    Neil Reed – 1994(transferred)
    Jason Collier – 1996(transferred)
    Luke Recker – 1997(transferred)
    Dane Fife – 1998
    Jared Jeffries – 2000
    Bracey Wright – 2002
    D.J. White – 2004
    Eric Gordon – 2007
    Cody Zeller – 2011
    Kevin “Yogi” Ferrell – 2012

    I have nothing against getting talent and I’m certainly not apologizing for coaches that can do so within the parameters of satisfying academic expectations and recruiting rules. I don’t think it’s essential to stack a roster top-to-bottom(e.g.UK) to win championships. I believe Crean is doing his best to keep Indiana kids interested in bringing IU back to the forefront of college basketball. And he’s also a talented enough salesperson to probably do a better job attracting nationally spotlighted talent than Knight.

  17. Hola everyone,

    Yeah so IU’s return to prominence isn’t yet complete, so I agree with all of Dustin’s points. This year should be great, but it’s definitely a possibility that we go 29-5 and a 2-seed in the NCAA tournament, make it to the Final Four before losing to a another very good team. That is certainly a successful season, especially considering where we’ve been, but does a #4 final ranking put us in the class of a UK, UNC, or Duke’s class as far as top recruits (outside of Indiana) are concerned? I doubt it.

    Call me a hater if you want, but until we do this at a consistent level for afew years in a row we can’t be taking anything for granted.

    By the way it’s extremely homer-ish and IU-centric to think that our return to prominence was the second biggest story in sports this year. We weren’t even the biggest story in college basketball this season – that honor unfortunately belongs the UK who went 38-2, won the National Championship, had Anothony Davis sweep every single award given out, and had 6 players drafted into the NBA. Tebow was a bigger story (Just about any NFL story is bigger). LeBron and the Heat were a bigger story.

    Indiana may have been a BETTER story than all of those, but certainly didn’t move the Q-meter the same way.

    Sorry Tsao and Harvard… I know how reality ruins your day.

    Keep up the hard work and hustle Crean (and crew)!

  18. More “Establishment” talk. Go suck on your blue blankie, UK homer.

    “….second biggest story in sports this year.”

    That’s your quote, but it’s not what I said in post #8. Learn to read. I said “college story,” Mr. NBA blowbags.

  19. Ok… But like I said… Just eliminate the pro stories I mentioned. Pretend I stopped after UK. I’m also gonna say that an all-SEC BCS football championship and Bama national title is a bigger story. Andrew Luck was a bigger story. Bigtime football will always trump big time basketball, with the possible exception of really unlikely Cinderella runs or undefeated basketball champions.

    Apparently you would be shocked by just how insignificant IU basketball is outside of Big Ten country and die hard college hoops fans. The ONLY reason we became a national story this year was because of the Watford buzzer beater. Other than that we were one of 16 Sweet-16 teams, we were not a final season top 10 team, there were lots of teams with better records, and we didn’t have a single player in the NBA draft…

    It was an absolutely great experience for us IU fans, but you’re delusional if you think other people would bring it up in water cooler discussion or are still thinking about it.

  20. I thoroughly enjoy how those in the “Establishment” get their panties all in a fuss when little old Indiana begins to make some noise.

    They continue to want to believe we’re finished. They are the true Knight worshipers because they seem to believe Indiana Basketball will now forever live in spiraling downturn. They want to plant it in the heads our fine young men that believe in Indiana. They continue to remind that we only have 5 banners(which happens to be 3 more than the closest runner-up from the Big 10). They’ve never been able to come to terms with how those five banners grew out of an insignificant tiny state. They’ll never get it and they live in wanting because they’ll never replicate in their own backyards the passion that comes to Assembly every moment the men in candy-stripes take to the floor. I feel a bit sad they’ll never experience the delusional goosebumps that come along with mystical energy in the undaunted hearts. They reason away our crazy attachments to the game. “Those cornbred Indiana hicks are such simpletons for loving something that doesn’t steal the stage and make the blow of every sports talk show.” I guess it’s the world we live in, isn’t it? Unless it’s in the headlines…unless it’s propped up by media giants that decide what should be the ‘biggest story’ to pump into the heads of vegetables at their water coolers, they simply have nothing to attach their pathetic superficial love. When they see something true, the belief in something as simple and genuine, their predictable fearful response is to mock upon it with their cute cynicism.

    They are so sadly lost in their grounded envy. The Watford shot is a rare look into the mirror of the detestable truth they live to avoid.

  21. You’re worse than a hater. You’re the tired cynic afraid to believe. Your worn thin and putting a heart fully into humble wishes has long ago been a risk for an armor of arrogance too much pain such foolishness. Cling to blue blankie and your thick pink stat book that keeps your world in desired safe order. Move about the country and speak in truth upon the ear a naive heart ..Pick your favorite flavor and your next favorite team stacked with your “winners”…Pretend the highest price paid at a victory table is made with the same simple love your mom’s Sunday chicken dinner. Indiana has never died. The only thing sadly devoid is your pulse upon the passion a game you’ve turned into plastic mold to fit your empty plastic probabilities.
    Agree with Dustin. There is nothing wrong with the rationale and safety of being always right. Quit fussing about with your panties.

    Sit back, relax, and enjoy…There is no new day upon us. There is no new strength we’ve found. It was here for Davis when his unsung troops marched into Lexington and took down Duke. It was here for Knight in ’73 when a no-name kid named Downing outplayed a redheaded Bruin that needed a friendly whistle to erase the truth a mirror its honest frowning. It was here for Sampson when those untrue put our faith up for ransom.. It is the same day those less true sold out. Watford’s shot is only one small and tender sprout. You choose to believe the passion was born by the ball going in. Sorry, my cynic friend. It is the same passion an everlasting spring devoid of the winter your trusted and safe doubt.

  22. It may be that some of us are influenced by our strong ties to our Hoosiers but that’s the good part of being a Hoosier fan.

    Then there’s the emotionally and, to a degree, mentally challenged for whom we have created a completely separate sport that looks like basketball, is played with the same number of men, has a big post and a basket but is barely related to the original. This same sector, often results in outlandish, self-obsessed declarations such as ‘the gods empowered me to be the greatest analyst of basketball ever, a mathematically rational thinker able to dissect the game’s minutia after the game and determine, with some strong degree of accuracy, who won’ …only to qualify their analysis with that ultimate of logical conclusions “…the sucking refs hosed us to the tune of a minimum 10 bad calls.”

    Overcompensation?…the pathetic orgasms over the NBA, this orgy of Kentucky Blue Grass natural fertilizer, UK – world re known producer of illiterate equine stud-farm reproductive system holder-technicians …; no real Hoosier grads would tolerate our standards coming down that far.

    In all honesty, I should really be grateful…the comic relief it provides me with the occasional bursts of delirium and the visible insecurities that lead to this empty-bubbled narcissism does entertain, as it gets more self-involved with each post and bursts into explosions of self-delusion…. And; double grateful…knowing my Indiana University, my Hoosier basketball did not (and can’t possibly produce or graduate this exaggerated outlier) nor ever be that irrelevant. So, do continue to make me laugh Pagliacci, while on the sneak you wished you were a Hoosier.

    Isn’t that why you are so emotionally dependent on the approval of the Original and True Candy Stripes?

    Frangiana…Frangipana…you we hail IU…..

  23. Geoff-

    Please understand that I enjoy the chance to spar with you and did not intend the climate of viciousness that grew out of my overblown contrarian theatrics. I don’t get out much. Hahvahd hate to lose you as a blogging friend.

  24. Huge difference between “tired cynic afraid to believe” and a realist that understands where IU basketball currently ranks in the national landscape. I fully believe we will get to the point we are discussing – where IU basketball is as relevant to fans and recruits as any program in the country regardless of where they live. But for anyone to suggest we’ve already reached that point point is delusional or IU-centric (or both).

    And to address Tsao’s last rant… I understand to a degree what you’re saying, BUT…

    Pro football today looks nothing like it did in your youth (other than same number of players and same size field)

    Golf is nothing like it was in your youth (infinitely more grooming techniques, infinitely more access, players actually work out, huge changes in ball and club technology)

    Baseball is barely similar to what it was in your youth (mound changes, bullpens, black players)

    The Indy 500 is raced at speeds 150 mph faster than when you were a kid.

    MAYBE soccer looks about the same(?)

    The world and sports change buddy. It’s just kinda the way life has always seemed to work

  25. Tsao – I did like the little “true IU grad” comment that you slipped in. I’m left to assume that a true IU grad is either:

    A) an IU graduate from your era
    B) an IU grad who views the world the same as you

    My guess is that leaves out the majority of IU grads of the last 25 years at least, and a decent portion from the last 50 years (my step-mother was part of a very large hippie culture at IU in the 60’s)

    If I am the “clown” you were referring to, then you’re wrong. I don’t sneaky wish I was a Hoosier. I actually am a Hoosier – both by birth and by choice. Oh, and I have much more pride in IU than for my actual alma mater.

    I could be wrong, but I think you meant… “Gloriana, frangipana………. Hail to old IU…”

    But I guess a real IU grad would be correct, the words were probably different back in the day.

  26. Sure…

    Miami can go from a lottery team to an annual title contender by signing LeBron and Bosh.

    The Colts can go from annual title contender to the first pick with one injury

    And the Hoosiers can go from irrelevant to powerhouse in the world of college hoops in a matter of 2 years.

    But it takes more than one shot, a sweet 16 appearance, and a final season ranking of #13 before we become relevant to the casual fan. It takes more than preseason hype, a couple in-state McDonald’s All-Americans, and ZERO draft picks in the last 4 years before we can just assume that all the top 50 recruits want to come to IU.

    Notice that I didn’t say it wouldn’t happen, or that we aren’t well on our way. I guess I just forgot to put on my 20-80 glasses this morning – those are the ones that only allow you to see what’s right in front of you… Right?

  27. Actually the speeds at the 500 are no where near 150 mph greater(qualifying or winners average)than 50 years ago.

  28. The 100 mph mark at Indy had to be before WWII and the 200 mph was not long after the STP Turbine sensation. Maybe TTG is.

  29. Qualifying speeds are about 100 mph faster today than 50 years ago and 120-140 mph faster than 70-80 years ago

    http://www.indystar.com/interactive/article/99999999/MULTIMEDIA/120517028/Indy-500-history-speeds-Indianapolis-Motor-Speedway

    Of course the point is that if you dropped my dead great grandfather into present day, he wouldn’t recognize basketball, football, racing, politics, cars, teenagers…

    You name it, it’s all changed during Tsao’s life time. I’m not saying the changes are good, bad, whatevah. I’ll leave those judgements up to Tsao and Harvard. I just don’t think you have to ONLY appreciate knight-era, indiana hoosier-brand basketball to be a true Hoosier fan. Or that that style of basketball is the only way the game should be played or appreciated.

  30. And looking at the string of comments Tsao must have been referring to Harvard anyway with the whole pagliacci comment…

    I don’t think any of my comments approached narcissism.

    Anyone who doesn’t think that refs effect the outcomes of some, not all, games is also either delusional or not paying attention. Ask Doug Collins to show you his silver medal… Oh yeah, he never accepted it.

  31. Kinda like I thought. Actually I also appreciate McCracken-era, Indiana Hoosier-brand BB too. Before your time. It is MD-era style BB that should not be played as it is hard to appreciate anything so painful to watch. That was the timeline defining a true IU fan. I suppose that is why he is the new interim coach at Texas Southern. I wonder if TSU and Lamar play each other, would that not be a twist of fate?

  32. If there was only one “right way” to play basketball… IU-style from 1940-2000, then how come we only have 5 national titles. (out of 60 potential championships)?

    Apparently other styles have worked and continue to work as well.

    I guess I am truly narcissistic to think that others have been successful as well.

  33. Crean may be bringing us closer to a fashionable era of hoops(if you define that as being attractable to the next NBA one-and-done sensations that arrives with no real personal attachment the institution represented by their college uniform), but he’s about as culturally modern as 1968 Chevy Caprice meets My Three Sons meets Jim Baker.

    We would be light-years ahead with a man as modern as Tsao at the helm of the Hoosiers. Age is simply a number. Stalling oneself in the burdens of realism any achievements slightly outside the immediate grasp, doesn’t come off as progressive..Hope is very modern and propels men to escape what others choose to use as anchor of negativity. Knight was never about the banners…It’s simply the desire to do it better and not be burdened by the “hand coming out of the sky” or perceived limitations yourself. What you could achieve together could far outweigh anything you were as individual. It was also about building something more lasting than the symbols and the dusty trophies in glass cases. I tend to believe that’s a form of modernism severely lacking in the world of college athletics.

    Don’t get me wrong, I’m not a Knight worshiper, but let’s quit pretending that winning at any cost, hanging banners, finding relevancy for mere sake of being relevant, making huge inroads in recruiting, necessarily makes for something culturally progressive that is beneficial to the character of individuals or society as a whole.

  34. Though the new young gun coming out of the farm leagues of Maine is throwing heat like never seen before, don’t underestimate Tsao..He’s a crafty and wily veteran with just the right amount of mystical talent to capture younger hearts, go retro, and take you deep.

  35. I remember being in the trophy room at the union and seeing a page within a frame entitled ‘The Story of Frangipana’. I thought, ‘this should be interesting’, so I took to reading it.

    Basically, the were some students on a train traveling to an IU game singing about their beloved IU, rhyming verses as they came. One lad ended a verse with ‘Gloriana’.

    Waiting for the interesting story it went on…’so they made up a word, frangipana’.

    WTF? That’s it? They just needed a word that rhymed so they came up with ‘frangipana’?

    I felt so cheated.

    Thus ended my study break at the Union.

  36. Fun Facts

    Ever wonder where the phrase “Gloriana, Frangipana” came from? In the fall of 1892, a train full of IU fans was headed to the Purdue campus for a game. A group of students decided a new “yell” was in order, but what word would rhyme with “Indiana?” An undergraduate named Ernest H. Lindley, who worked at his father’s pharmacy, remembered a soap sold in the store that was derived from a popular fragrance called Frangipana. The rest is history. The next year, Joe T. Giles wrote words to a Scottish song for the IU glee club, incorporating part of the new “yell.” His song, Hail to Old IU, provided an alma mater. The frangipani flower, by the way, is tropical and is often used in Hawaiian leis. There’s a Frangipani Room at the Indiana Memorial Union.

    Come and join in song together,
    Shout with might and main;
    Our beloved Alma Mater,
    Sound her praise again.
    Gloriana Frangipana, E’er to her be true
    She’s the pride of Indiana,
    Hail to Old IU!….ahchoo!

  37. Harvard – does Duke win at all costs?

    Somehow they’ve managed to be relevant to the masses, attract top flight recruits year after year from anywhere in the country, and send players to the NBA at the highest rate in the last 20 years, some one and done, but many not.

    Obviously Coach K learned a lot from Bobby, but there aren’t many people who would confuse Duke’s massive on-ball pressure and perimeter gunning with Knight’s version of fundamental man to man and motion offense with 5 passes before a shot.

    All I’m saying is that some people seem to think being a true Hoosier means thinking that the only way to play ball is our way.

    I respect lots of coaches and systems, but in the end I’m an IU fan and only route for IU.

  38. No…I really did mean Geoff as “I Pagliacci”, particularly the sad characters finding that when he tears away the costume there is nothing but the total disdain from the one he loved; and, once he strips away the layers of paint, there is nothing left…not even the fantasy that gave him meaning.

    I may have differences with Harvard; differences which with a beer and 10 minutes worth of arguing wouldn’t amount to one hell of beans. But in Harvard I sense a human being I could respect and like (and continue to argue incessantly with), but someone who has values and, more important, understands and assumes those values like an up front man.

    On the other hand, I do know when I sense a complete void.

    Yes, those games have changed and where the changes nurture an exaggerated sense of individualism or ‘me!’, ‘me!’, ‘me!’ or see value only in ‘winning’ or ‘championships’ (i.e. who can possibly admire Kentucky’s Rent-A-Center junk?)…it should become part of the “Sports for Idiots” Collection). The contrast of the legacy of a Bob Knight, a Thad Stephens and a Calipari (who in fact is nothing more than a ‘before-the-crash Kelvin Sampson)is described only by defining the totally different dimensions they exist in. (with Knight’s petulance thrown in as well).

    But regardless, (and, by the way, since it seems to obsess you; I’m 71 have had a great life full of great events, screw ups and enjoyed and continued to enjoy each and every moment of it), I respect people who understand that what we accomplish together, as a product of the whole is where our ‘exceptionalism’ lies and should lie. I’d explain this concept to you, but it is just one of those things my 71 ywears have taught me, not to waste breath trying to teach someone who can’t possibly get it, devoid of the concept of ‘We’…so I’ll just go have a more lucid conversation with someone who’ll eventually get it, like my 20 month old grandson.

    Finally, I think there’s just one word to describe your narcissism..’cute’…you may not even be very good at being a narcissist.

  39. It samazing what being wrong and called out on it does to you Tsao…

    About the only thing I know about our relationship is that if we had the chance to sit back on a porch and have a couple beers together we would both enjoy it.

    I am (although I’m sure you doubt it) a much better listener than a talker. I enjoy stories. And if it’s one thing I know about 71 year old men it’s that they have lots of stories and like to tell them. I would get a great deal out of that, and you would be surprised by my demeanor and affable attitude to the point where after 10 minutes you would completely forget I was the guy you argued with on the Scoop.

  40. Have your Duke and shove it. Just viewing the name on Scoop brings this Hoosier to vomit reflex. The passion for basketball and the overall talent coming from the state of Indiana puts anything inside their borders to shame. And without feeding off of the private academy systems(transplanted high school kids shifted out of their hometowns) they would be irrelevant. There’s nothing grass roots it their history. Without the teachings of ‘K’ long ago inherited from Knight, the timely hijacking of key big men away from Indiana, the best recruiting they would be known for in their hoops talent devoid state would be the landing of desperate prostitutes to feed the filthy souls rich-a$$ pervert snots that play a girls game called Lacrosse.

    You love your stats so much, maybe you should check Duke’s head-to-head record against IU in the NCAA tournament(.333).
    A Mike Davis coached Hoosier squad(filled primarily with Indiana kids and one future NBA role player) took care of a #1 Duke just fine in the NCAA tournament. More heart..always more heart when it counts. And Duke didn’t get the best Zeller this round, my friend. The head Dukie dweeb is losing his touch…losing it a whole lot. Cody is no follower. He didn’t come to Indiana because of guarantees, a surrounding roster of McDonald’s All-Americans, an overrated coach, smoochy phone 3-way phone call, or passionate tweet. He took the path of most resistance. He took the path of rewarding the heartbeat of college basketball played at McCracken. It irks the sh*t out of Duke and NC …and all those yellow in belly in love the sure thing limelight, the neutral site, and the color blue….Boohoo. Go hire a Portland stripper and get over it.

  41. I shall conclude my contribution to this thread with my version of a Scoop spam protection math problem:

    Duke + Bobby Knight + Tsao = ?

  42. Harvard, I don’t dispute any of the non-hyperbole things you mentioned in that rant. I am not holding up Duke as the model by which all others should aspire. They are simply another example of a program who has won with honor and within the generally respected moral code of college hoops fans. Personally I can’t stand Duke. Always hated them (except Johnny Dawkins, for some reason when I was a kid I loved him). But the difference between us is that apparently I can respect them.

    I know you like to go off on tangents that have little to do with the argument, but everything I’ve written has dealt with 3 issues:

    1) a response to the very first post by Aruss.
    2) your contention that IU was the second biggest story in college sports last year
    3) the elitist statements, mainly from Tsao, that IU basketball pre-2000 was the only real pure form of basketball, and that a true Hoosier would understand that. (slight paraphrasing, but I didn’t want to take up 6 paragraphs to re-state his point)

    One of these days maybe we’ll be able to have a debate where you stay on topic instead of making me chase you all the place proving most everything you say as grandeur at best and false at worst. Of course that would take every ounce of fun out of it for you, so I don’t have high hopes.

  43. I give him this, after the national championship (which is generally the biggest story in ANY season, with notable exceptions) IU basketball was easily the second biggest college basketball story of the year. I agree there are too many variables to make a broader claim on the national scene.

    I prefer pre-2000 basketball on a personal note. Coach K famously said his teams from the 80’s “would kill these guys” when asked to compare championship teams he has coached. I believe his major point being that it would be talented seniors versus talented freshmen and sophomores.

    Summer is taking it’s toll on you guys. At least this year we have the Olympics. My delightful mother-in-law, near the end of her life, said she just wanted to live long enough to see my youngest son wrestle in the Olympics. He never made it. The closest he ever got was a summer at the Olympic Training Center in Colorado Springs prepping for the trials. Enjoy those kids’ performances. It is so hard to get there. I’ll bet Cody gives it a shot one day if he gets the opportunity. It seems like something he’d want to do.

  44. I hate those stupid made up sports (ballroom dancing, ribbon twirling, synchronized gardening). Awarding medals for that crap cheapens the experience for the real Olympians who have moved heaven and Earth just to get the opportunity to represent their country.

  45. As it turns out for near every Olympics the only events I try to watch are BB, most Track and Field, Rowing, Freestyle Wrestling, Boxing, some Gymnastics, Shooting when shown, Archery and some Swimming. The horses, sailing and badminton are good opportunities to mow lawn, grab a nap or catch reruns on Soapnet. The NEW Handball this year I am still cyphering on.

  46. 1. The defeating of #1 UK and #2 OSU on nationally televised games during the regular season, the blowing out of the water of TV rankings all other games in the NCAA(outside the Final Four)for the Sweet 16 rematch between IU vs Kentucky( 8.5 million viewers compared to 5.9 million for Xavier vs. Baylor), and the ESPY award given to Watford for the game-winner “Play of the Year” (which was also repeated on thousands of commercial breaks during the March Madness tournament prior to the official declaration), I still believe the resurgence of IU Basketball was the second biggest college sports story of the year. Almost 60% as many viewers watched the IU vs. Kentucky rematch in the Sweet 16 as the championship game. IU reclaiming a bit its b-ball mojo is very good for the bottom line of ESPN, the Big 10, the NCAA, and all of college sports.

    Your quote: “Bigtime football will always trump big time basketball”

    You may find this interesting:

    Compared to other sports, Monday’s game outdrew four of this year’s five BCS title games, five of the seven games of last year’s World Series, five of the six games of last year’s NBA Finals, and assorted marquee events such as the Daytona 500 (8.0, 13.669M) and the final round of last year’s Masters golf tournament (9.5, 15.257M)…

    2. I said that I’m plenty satisfied with Tom Crean continuing to strongly recruit young top talent. My qoute:

    And I don’t care if the Conway kid’s stature makes him eligible to be named Snow White’s “Flashy” 8th Dwarf…If Crean thinks he’s a promising point guard, then I’m trusting his judgment.

    Keep ‘em coming….Recruit them from their mommy’s womb for all I care.

    Without debating the ethical side of the argument, I believe that young talent outside our borders willing to look at IU four years into the future is supportive of IU Basketball surging back to relevancy.

    3. I’ve never claimed Knight’s style of basketball(offensive/defensive tactics) was more “pure” than any other form. I love athleticism and watching games that highlight contrasting styles. I also think it’s pretty special to watch kids stick together for a few years and experience the atmosphere of college to its fullest. That being said, I rarely persecute a kid that leaves for the NBA early. I get far more upset when kids abandon their high schools/teammates for merely putting their name on a bigger stage and up their status on a Rivals’ ranking board.

    4. Sadly, the Penn State scandal, the unveiling of the despicable actions taken against children in a football locker room, and the 15-yr cover-up to protect a coach and the almighty dollar of a prominent college sports program, trumped all other stories.

  47. 5. When you don’t like a foul call during a Hoosier game next year, instead of overcompensating for your normally lackluster Hoosier faith, overacting, and taking 30 posts of a thread to rant like a hungry chimp yanked off the furry nipple, just do this.

  48. Scratch everything I’ve said…

    The biggest story of the year was a blogger named Harvard predicting the victories over UK and OSU…predicting a freshman kid named Remy would step up and deliver in big games, predicting Christian Watford would shine when other Hoosier fans were throwing him under the bus after the first two weeks of the season…predicting 22 wins…predicting a top 10 national ranking by mid-December..when every blogger, sports analyst, coach, IU fan, casual fan, sports junkie fan, big-time heads of sports gambling rings hiding from the IRS in small towns in Maine… never saw it coming. No doubt, Harvard was the biggest story in college sports.

  49. A gift for Harvard,… Chet… Podunker, HC, and all of those who are capable of understanding the point and have the wisdom of the message. This is what we Hoosiers should shoot for year-after-year. Not the Rent-A-Center Fab-Five Stable of one-and-done in Lexington becomes only a rumor of a culture.

    Seriously, a great story about a team that made Olympic basketball history, gave it the beauty it deserves and literally taught the US the beautiful way to play this game, while making it socially relevant along the lines suggested by HfH in oe of his best posts ever..

  50. I WILL NOT say tati prefer the current Team USA ball over more fluid styles, but 2004 was all about system and buy-in, not talent or style.

    There was no “team” in place, just mercenaries thrown together with actual narcissism.

  51. Geoff, absolutely correct.

    HC, I’ve never understood who gets the medal in those horse events. With the recent interest in some of the events due to well known owners I have learned that often the owners barely know the riders. Many of the riders receive minimal financial compensation (more than minimum wage but not a whole lot more). They are just another member of the ‘staff’.

    I know there are some stories of semi regular folks riding their own steeds and I don’t know how much of either group is involved. That is, I don’t know which is the norm.

    But my question is, if the horse is the property of a wealthy sponsor but the rider is the one with their name on the list of competitors, will the owner seize possession of the medal (can they?) or let the ‘ranch hand’ hang on to it.

  52. Normally “money talks”, as you know. I don’t know, could we both be surprised on this? I am sure the bluebloods and tea and crumpet bunch keep it an Olympic event.

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