1. Recruit great players who are great students who graduate in 2.5 or 3 years and this is the result. These kids, just like all of us who went to school, want a career and they come to IU to get it, whatever it may be.

    We should all be proud that our players leave with a degree, or obvious plans to finish it, after a short tenure vs. all of the other BS that goes on in college basketball, s.a. Ben McLemore, Carter-Williams, and too many others.

    Whether Z is ready or not for the NBA will be seen at a later date, perhaps 4 or 5 years down the road.

    These two announcements are clearly riddled with “marketing” for the program. It is a success story for smart, talented kids to come in and leave early for the NBA with their degrees. Contrast that to UK where the studs take the minimum 3 courses in their first Fall semester and drop 2 classes after Spring semester begins and remain eligible for the tournament and then leave. Crean is touting the “graduate in 3 yrs.” mantra and it will likely serve him well in the years ahead as far as recruiting goes.

    Should be an interesting and passionate year in 2013 – 14.

  2. So recruits no longer care about winning championships?

    UK will be playing for another banner next year. The media Establishment doesn’t care about Kentucky’s reputation. The NCAA doesn’t seem to believe Calipari is doing anything wrong at Kentucky.

    A great rivalry has died. We’ll have two Sweet 16 banners while UK, loaded with McDonald’s All-Americans, will likely be playing for another championship next season.

    If Crean doesn’t get us past a Sweet 16 in the next two years, nobody will care if he’s placing a couple good students in the NBA every year.

    Programs are measured by banners. That’s all I ever heard over the last two years. My, oh my, how the tune has changed.

    We’ve become IU football…Graduate some kids…Go to a Rose Bowl every twenty years. Market a bunch of fancy slogans for billboards. Place one or two guys in the NFL every other year.

    Sounds like complacency. Sounds like a complete lack of confidence in the man we’ve hired to even be able to accomplish what Brad Steven did at Butler. Aren’t his players good students? Did that stop them from getting to two championship games?

  3. Austin Etherington..He cared about banners. He cared about completing the mission. All that work he put into convincing his AAU teammates to be part of something special..All that heart. Zeller era, my butt. These dollar chasers abandoned a mission they weren’t tough enough to fight ’til the end. VJ III had more backbone. Danny Moore had more love for the candy-stripes.

    It will be very sad day when we watch Etherington forced off the team next year; forced off for another one of those sleeper talents via the Crean pipeline to the East that he can land in the NBA in a couple years. Yippee.

  4. I think Indiana will hoist another banner in the near future and possibly a second within a decade. That’s my prediction.

    That would put them right at the pinnacle of college basketball.

    On top of that, our guys DO graduate and, YES, that is important. I read about some player or manager (i.e. Lawrence Frank) running an NBA team as coach or president or perhaps in charge of some other aspect of the operation because these guys have their Kelley School of Business degrees in their hands. They don’t just have a few headlines, they have the acumen.

    All I ever seem to read about former Kaintuck players are stories that have the word ‘tragic’ somewhere in the headline.

    Players don’t stop living at 29 (I’m guessing the average NBA career ends around then). Coming to IU and graduating IS a big deal to me. When I see a kid sign with Kaintuck I just think ‘how sad’. He’s probably got a 1 in 10 shot at playing more than 2 years in the NBA and then what? I’ve told the story of my father-in-law’s best friend who went to UK and never learned to read AND HE GRADUATED. If they’re lucky they might get handed a PR job in the state of Kentucky (what a price to pay) because someone might remember they played for the Cats.

    How pitiful.

    As for me, if we make it to the Sweet Sixteen nearly every year and haul down a banner, let’s say, 3 times in CTC’s career while all the players graduate then I’d say RMK would have to look up at him.

    Speaking of graduating, my daughter, the hepthathlete and hurdler (currently injured), will graduate from Cornell next month. I went to a track meet Saturday. It was a combined team from Cornell and Penn vs. a combined team from Oxford and Cambridge. I was easily the dumbest person in the stadium, possibly the town. I commented to my wife that there was a good chance that someone there would be ruling the world, or at least a good part of it, in the next 20 years. It was interesting talking to all those young people. They casually talked about world shaping research the way some people might talk about their cat.

  5. Harvard,if you think Scott May wouldn’t have left for $10 million after the 1975 season, then you understand human nature as poorly as you understand basketball. He didn’t stay because he cared more about championships than Cody or Victor, he stayed because there was far less available to him at that time, and in any case he wasn’t allowed to leave early.

    I suggest you learn to love DIII basketball. There you could watch “pure” basketball unsullied by normal human ambition and self-interest.

  6. The guy had an “era” named after him. What else does a man need?

    I think he feared how inept he would look without the presence and versatility of Watford.

    His wallet will be thicker, but his name will be quickly thinned and forgotten. Legends take risks for something they truly love. If he truly loved Indiana, then he would live up to the “never daunted” spirit our fight song.

    Fight for the Cream and Crimson,
    Loyal sons of our old I. U.
    Fight for your Alma Mater,
    and the school you love so true.
    Fight for old Indiana,
    See her victories safely through,
    For the glory of old I. U.!

    Bob Knight at the Bloomington Walmart today!! Get in line, Crean.

  7. AZ and Harv, I agree with parts of both arguments. AZ is absolutely right that that we should be proud that IU is turning out fine young men with great character that exemplify the term student-athlete. I was a little less skeptical of Cody’s decision after reading his degree plans. It doesn’t quite have the stench of take-the-money-and-run that so many of today’s players wreak of when they bolt for early entry.

    But I also cringe every time I hear someone say “there’s no reason for him to stay.” Whether we’re talking about Cody, Vic, or any NBA-calibre player from any program across the country, unless you’re out of eligibility there’s always a chance to play for a banner next year. That seems pretty important to me. Indiana would have been another strong contender with one or both of them returning. What we may lose in shooting and experience we’d gain in athleticism and defense, qualities far more dependable when all of a sudden the shots aren’t falling. (In fact, we really wouldn’t have lost too much in experience. We would have likely been starting 2 Sr, 1Jr, 1 Soph, and 1 frosh with Vic, Will, Cody, Yogi, and Vonleh. Same breakdown as this year. With a deeper bench. But I digress…)

    Back to my point. It’s not that kids these days don’t care about Championships, but it’s all about instant gratification. The window is smaller. We haven’t gone the shameful Kentucky route of one-and-doners who make a mockery of student-athletics. Our guys put their time in the classroom. But we haven’t been able to expect elite players to stick around four years for some time now. Would we be saying that Etherington cares about banners if he too was a projected lottery pick with a degree near in hand? He’d probably be gone. It’s easy to say I’d stick around at least until one banner was hung, maybe two. But I’ll never have millions of dollars dangled in front of me either. I won’t ever have to make that decision. So it’s not up to me to judge others who do.

  8. Chet-

    Best wishes for your daughter and pass along congrats. Great accomplishment at such a respected university.

    IU not appealing to her? Can’t blame her. The place has been overrun by Kentucky hillbillies. Soon as Knight left, the floodgates opened. Bring in a preacher and the Bible Belt pushes even more northward.

  9. She loves IU. All my kids at one point or another considered attending. She just wanted to go for it all the time. Got accepted to Princeton and Cornell. Not bad for a public school kid from the mountains. She went to class, ran track, and usually juggled three or four jobs at any given time in Ithaca. Just the way she’s wired.

    She couldn’t have been competitive in Big Ten track, either, to be honest. She wanted to go to the best school possible and still compete in D1. I think she made a good choice.

    She’s planning on doing her doctoral work at a good ‘ol North Carolina state university and pay that in state tuition. While the public schools aren’t always the best (they’re pretty good around Asheville) the state universities are actually quite good.

  10. Punjab-

    Nice post. I would only add that the things you’ll miss most when you grow old will never involve bank accounts.

    Money won’t bring back the days you thought full of stress but in reality carefree. Money won’t bring back your kids fully grown and moved away. Money won’t bring back a loved one passed on. Memories and things you did unselfishly for those that believed in you will swirl around the thoughts your last breath.

    I was just hoping…It gets so tiresome to see wealth flaunted. It gets so commonplace to see fame desired more than brotherhood and belief in collective purpose.

    I think it’s rather sick to name those desires as an “era.” When you’ve been out of college for over 20 years, two years seems like two minutes. The clock will now move very fast for Cody. He was in a moment where he captured eyes and hearts of young kids. He was in a moment of timeless spirit and example. He really doesn’t understand just how lucky to stop time. How lucky to have those young kids piling into Assembly to see their example and hold such pride in their hearts as something bigger than life.

  11. Chet-

    My only hope is that my kid is nothing like me. I hope my kid has more of the outgoing DNA. There was always a strange split of extroverts and introverts in my family. My father loved people, but his brother was a very quiet man and very anti-social. All his sisters were also full of ambition and outgoing.

    I’ve tried to fight it forever…I can’t even identify when it happened. Something happened that turned me inward. You hit it on the head…A lot of it is just “wiring.” I pray my kid doesn’t have my wiring.

  12. All my kids have way more on the ball than I did. Well, one hasn’t quite found his nitch but he’s gonna graduate college next year and he was one of the best college wrestlers in the country at one time. He’ll figure it out. Could be a lot worse. The other two just set the bar pretty high.

    I didn’t start having kids until I was 31. They grew up seeing Dad as a motivated professional trying to do his best for his family. If they had been born when I was 21 I’d have presented them with an entirely different kind of role model.

    Luck of the draw.

  13. Not to say I’m like Harvard, but; For 35 yrs I was a manager in Health Care. Dealing with patients, Drs., staff, family/visitors etc. At the end had 210 people reporting to me. Enjoyed it. Now retired and have no desire to interact with anyone other than family. My dream home would be on top of a mountain or in the middle of a forest. Just need books and coffee.

    This goes back, I think, to the mid 80’s. Small island off of Englewood Florida. Rented a cabin for the summer. The few residents in the summer enjoyed the peace and solitude. Took some time to get used to the ‘clothing of any kind discouraged’. Only access to island was a weekly ferry (daily during the winter months), or your own boat.

    Than spent 5 yrs on a spread in rural Fl. Dirt driveway mile long, no tv, no phone. Loved it.

    Went to Chicago last weekend. First time there in 50 yrs. Spent the whole time wondering why someone would want to live there. Yet I love Miami. Multi-culture, vibrant, alive and a relaxed dress code so to speak. Even Martinsville is too busy.

  14. Harvard…

    Post #2 – programs are measured in banners. The Establishment doesn’t care HOW Kentucky does it. They will be there next year with their hired guns. IU is complacent… Sweet 16’s are good enough for us now.

    Post #3 – Austin Etherington wants to win championships. We are going to kick him out the door to make room for a hired gun. What’s wrong with IU?

    So typical. Call IU complacent and satisfied in one post and cut-throat in the next, and admonish them for both. Say that championships are most important in one post, but then put a player who would be a non-factor ahead of that goal in the next post… And admonish IU for both.


  15. Geoff, a sad reality about the passing of hoops season is that we now spend our time dissecting posts rather than basketball. I guess for some of us that’s a sport in its own right.

    Thinking about Harv’s #10 though, it’s a great post. The only thing I would add is that the money means different things to different people. For McLemore and others, it means getting his family– what did they say, ten people living in a small apartment in KC– out of poverty. Can’t fault a man for that. For others, it means being able to pimp your ride(s) and shamelessly blow through tens of thousands of dollars at a night club with your posse. For men like Cody, it seems to be about fulfilling a lifelong dream and seeing all the good he can do with it. If true, that’s the honorable way to go about it.

    I personally don’t need much. I live life simply. Living on a single military-income budget, my family kind of has to for now. But we have everything we need, and we’re comfortable. I have my degree, my wife has two, and once the kids are all school-age and she goes back to work, we’ll be able to save more and still acquire some of those niceties and toys (been eyeing a bass boat for years, my wife a lake house in the country) that some people seem to “need” to live “comfortably.”

    Financial security isn’t a one-size-fits-all notion. If I were in Cody’s position and– barring injury– I were guaranteed millions whether I’m the #9 pick this year or the #21 pick in 2015, I choose to stay. I don’t need the prestige of being a lottery pick– in fact, I run a much higher risk of being considered a bust three or four years down the road– and that 2-3 million dollar difference over the span of my first contract doesn’t prevent me from feeding my family or putting the kids through school. I wouldn’t have to worry about these things regardless of where I’m drafted. So I choose to live for the now, create those memories that Harv reminds us will be there long after the fanfare is gone and family grown. And I choose to take my chances leading my beloved school to a Championship or two.

    Dozens of people get to call themselves NBA draftees every year. But how many of those get to call themselves NCAA Champion? That’s what makes a Hoosier a legend.

  16. I’m pretty surprised to see the level of anger directed towards Vic and Cody from some fans. I’m sure that if banner #6 was hanging from the rafters, this would be easier to digest.

    I’m firmly in the disappointment camp with how the season ended. However, Cody and Vic have given me some of the best memories I’ve experienced as a faithful Indiana Hoosier since I walked into Briscoe in 1995. It would be the ultimate act of selfishness to be upset that these fine young men wouldn’t move on to pursuing their dreams as the opportunity arose.

    As to Indiana’s future? No idea. I do know that the realities that college programs have to face nowadays are the same ones whether your wear candy stripes or any other programs. We may not like it, but ‘dems the facts and we have to deal with them. We have a lot of work to do to get back and, hopefully, beyond what was accomplished this year. Crean still has something to prove as well as the players who are both returning and coming in.

    Regardless, good luck, Vic and Cody. Thanks for the incredible memories. You’re moving on and so are we (well most of us anyway).

  17. H4H #2. I have posted a concern about the characteristics of this Crean team. While coach’s characteristics get passed on to the players, I’m seeing a pattern emerge starting with the opportunity to close out the Big10 conference. The last 4 games of the year, the Big10 Tourney, The 3 games on the NCAA, there was no fire anywhere in these players. Seemed as if they were playing with fear, far more fear required to play at a high level.

    I hope in the end I’m wrong but, you might have touched a big topic for the next few years, Crean may not be able to get us to the Final4. If an opportunity ever existed it was now, these 4 players leaving had tons of talent, tons of playing experience. I don’t even see a Sweet16 next year.

  18. Now all that’s left is to look forward to the end of another era: the Crean Tom Coach “era”.

  19. That’s actually an interesting comparison. I have a lt of respect for Collison. Great glue guy and definitely a championship piece without being a star. I never would have come up with that myself. Glad you did.

    Great to be on Hoosier soil again… Even though my 8 pm flight out of O’Hare didn’t end up taking off until 2:30 am. Late night, long day.

  20. so chester was “easily the dumbest person in the stadium, possibly the town.” what a surprise.

  21. I always likened Cody to a young Tim Duncan. Same quiet demeanor. Same emphasis in academics. Had his priorities straight. Never seemed to get rattled. Just quietly put up solid numbers and usually came through with winning plays. Cody doesn’t have the same rebounding prowess and he’s not proven to be anywhere her the same defender, so that’s probably an unfair comparison on that front. But we’ve seen flashes of the same offensive skill set, and Duncan didn’t really become a big time scorer at WF until Loren Woods (see Fischer, Luke) relieved some of the pressure in the post.

    Time will tell if Cody’s game can continue to develop. I suspect he’s not come close to his ceiling. Probably not a HOFer like Duncan, but I don’t think it’s absolutely out of the question, either.

  22. wow Punjab that is a hard-to-believe comparison. Duncan has about 10-12 more go-to post moves than Cody has ever even practiced. Cody is closer to Chris Mihm than he is Tim Duncan. The thing people forget about Cody is that he doesn’t have low post moves. If he had even Jared Sullinger’s low post game in his(Cody’s) body/size he’d be the #1 pick in the draft.

  23. Bombay, I started seeing similarities last year. Cody’s demeanor is what got me thinking, and his obvious potential is what got me believing. Maybe I’m just a victim of wishful thinking, just as I was about Cody coming back for another year. But I did make the comparisons to a *young* Tim Duncan. He didn’t have all those post moves his sophomore year. He may have had a few more at that point in his development than Cody’s shown so far– and Duncan also showed more willingness to shoot from outside earlier on– but Cody’s shown flashes. When and if Cody learns to finish taller and stronger around the hoop and gain confidence in his gameday jumpshot, to say that there are similarities in potential isn’t all that absurd.

  24. Yeah I just don’t see it, and his demeanor is the biggest reason as to why. Saying he’s soft spoken or a nice kid doesn’t really help him on an NBA court. I think, depending on the team he lands with, he’ll either be liked by the vets because he’s a ‘good kid’ or he’ll piss them off because he’s ‘soft.’ If you are afraid to shoot a jumper in college why would he take them in the NBA? If you are unlikely to dominate or enforce your will in a game against college peers why would you do it against 12 year NBA vets? He also doesn’t really have a ‘jumper’ he has a set shot that isn’t all that pure/athletic and it takes a long time to get it off. He’s being drafted more for his size and athleticism than anything else. I guarantee you no NBA team is looking at him to become a scorer for them. He’ll get easy buckets in transition and he’ll run the floor. Very rarely do players re-invent themselves as pros. If anything almost always their influence on a game regresses because of the increase in difficulty. Even in college Cody scored mainly on put backs or dump off dunks. The more I think about it the less likely I am to believe in Cody at all as a pro. And don’t forget- there is a reason he decided to leave this year- the draft is considered one of the worst in recent memory. Next year it is expected to be loaded. Cody is leaving for $ and will probably get picked about 10-15 spots higher than if he waited til next year, and no one can fault him for that choice. As an nba player though his contributions will be limited.

  25. Hello kids…

    My name is Cody Zeller. I’m an NBA basketball player. I’m rich. I’m like everybody else. I grew up in a family of basketball players. We’re all very tall. How did my brothers and I get so tall? Good question..I have no idea. We’re thinking that they put something in the morning cheerios…We’re thinking it was the frosted Cheerios that were disproportionally represented in higher numbers than normally found in your typical box of Team Cheerios. We asked our parents why so many frosted Cheerios in the Team Cheerios. They sat at the table in silence. The question was never asked again.

    I went to high school. I played on a team that was in something the state calls 3A.. Are any of you familiar with grocery store meat from the meat case? You have “select”…You have “choice”…and you have “prime.” My high school played in the “choice” category of high school basketball meats. I was a decent cut, but most the meats in 3A are inferior and rather chewy….with flavorless skills.

    Our championship was for those that can’t afford to put prime basketball on their table.

    College? Oh, yes…I went to college. Did I go to college to be a millionaire in the NBA. Huh, your funny. I actually went to college with hopes of becoming a doctor. Have your heard of Doctor J?

    I stayed at Indiana University to marinate my 3A skills that needed some tenderizing. I played against some prime beef and I was judged by some taste testers to be ready for the National Beef Association. Did I get my Doctor J degree or win a championship in college? Yes and no. The championship is very similar to a 3A blue ribbon in high school. It’s called a Sweet 16.

  26. “I was a decent cut, but most the meats in 3A are inferior and rather chewy….with flavorless skills.”

    That must be why Zeller was chosen as a McDonald’s All American, Indiana’s Mr. Basketball, and one of the top five best players coming out of High School. That’s why he was second team All American as a sophomore. That’s why he’s projected as a lottery pick in this year’s draft. I could go on about the honors he has received, but suffice it to say you have to try really hard to find any factual basis by which to diminish Cody Zeller’s accomplishments as a basketball player, especially in High School.

    Harvard, given the low opinion you continually express about of IU’s coaching staff and one of it’s top players, two decent and accomplished men, you’re no Hoosier fan.

  27. podunk- if that(off court bs) meant anything Tyler Hansbrough would be an NBA All-Star leading his team with 25 ppg and dominating the league. Accomplishments mean nothing, on court play means everything. How many times was Zeller named to the all tourney team, any all tourney team, in his time at IU???

    Again no one is saying Zeller isn’t ‘good.’ But that doesn’t matter, the frustrating part was he isn’t nearly as ‘good’ as he could be….just like this team, it ended in disappointment. Talking about what they did doesn’t mean they couldn’t do more. Crean spoke that way to keep the expectations down. But since when did what you did yesterday keep you from doing what you could do today or tomorrow? Zeller and IU were a disappointment the last month of the season, everyone knows this. Losing isn’t the reason, how they played was. Some don’t care(like you and Crean) and others do(nba gms who won’t draft him, IU fans who don’t mind that he left).

  28. I don’t see a 3A title, a Sweet 16(also achieved by Valparaiso, ISU, and Ball State)as anything “accomplished” for a program that wants to continually use banners that were won over a quarter century ago to define itself as “elite.”

    They “accomplished” slogans…Let’s review some of them:

    New Generation…
    It’s a process…
    Everything hinges on..
    We pray before every game…
    Tijan Forever…
    Zellerpalooza…(“He is not given to fits of giggles“)
    The Movement…
    The floodgates will open..
    Hoosier Rising…
    It’s a process…
    It’s a process…
    It’s a process…
    Player of the year..
    Coach of the year…
    Top 10 Recruiting class…
    Oladipo is going home..
    The Zeller era…

    Kaput. The charging of Jeff Meyer. A ton of Establishment tongue with no deep NCAA run. Wben all said and done, “The Movement” was not five top players, but merely one(Yogi). Two years of Zellerpalooza and press conferences to sell men with not enough heart to finish what they intended to “accomplish”…And not because they ran out of time or potential. They simply ran out of gas and slogans. But all is not lost…They pray before every game. They pray for a couple draft spots higher on draft night and bigger bucks in their wallets.

    I also pray before every game. I pray our fan base wakes up and quits buying the BS fed to us by a carnival salesman preacher. I pray they kick the Establishment opportunist coach with fat tongue learned at Sampson crucifixions more than b-ball evolution…I pray we have fans with brains enough to realize the chains of complacency shackled to words like “era” because they love those cheering and wearing the candy-stripes believing themselves as “accomplished” through easy addiction a plethora of self-anointing phrases and memorable slogans as measures of Hoosier basketball achievement, pride, and missions accomplished.

    If you buy into all that Establishment BS that lures into culture speeches, Bible quotes, the rest of the complacency the preacher has brought to this town, then you are the one that has NEVER been a Hoosier basketball fan.

  29. Funny..

    I thought “going home” was bringing a banner home for Kyle Taber.

    I thought an “era” was the first day that follows Mo Creek making his gingerly ascent up a ladder with two rapped knees that shall never taste an NBA floor; cutting down his humble small strand of championship net while we watch his teammates hoist him to the heavens. Now that would be a “Hoosier Rising.”

  30. Geoff-

    Maybe another time. I won’t make excuses..I’m just not a real trusting person. I somewhat like my privacy. I do appreciate the offer to have lunch and beers. I also appreciate your friendship on the blog.

  31. Want a good laugh? Watch the first few minutes of this video.

    “Huge, this is HUGE..This is major….Surefire pro..Great low post move…Excellent hook shot…Can really shoot from 17 to 18 feet now..That’s a major league player right there..In the olden days you could have seen him going straight from high school to pros…He reminds me of Amar’e Stoudemire a lot….he’s not a ‘Five,’ but he’s a nasty ‘Four’..All-American? Yeah…”

    You must watch the whole video, Geoff. It is fabulous stuff…It’s better than SNL…

    I’m missing the Dopirak/Kellenberger era. It ran wild and the enthusiasm could never be tempered. It was like watching Hans and Franz or the Two Wild and Crazy Guys…”We’re just here to pump you up!” Poor guys…They really did buy into the whole banner mystique about the place.

  32. haha I am a supporter of Hugh and Dustin but I’ll agree that has to make everyone, even them, laugh pretty hard….wow

  33. OH NO! It’s another “ESTABLISHMENT” rant from H4H.

    Bombay, perhaps you should go back and read Harvard’s (your) post again. He was referring to Zeller in High School. If Zeller was not an accomplished player in High School, than nobody ever has been.

  34. What’s bizarre is to watch the highlight tapes of HMP from 2010-12… He was such a fluid athlete. He DID run Iike a gazelle. He was agile.

    This year he looked pigeon-toed and stuck in the mud. He reminded me of an ineffective Trevor Imbakwe. He just wasn’t fluid at all on the court. I’m hoping that a year of dominance in off-season pick-up games will transform him to his prior self. Maybe he just needs confidence and swagger on the court… This year he was a deer in the headlights.

    He isn’t as raw skill-wise as You make him out to be Harvard. He also isn’t Olajuwan. Hoping that they are right about him as a future pro. I think the potential is still there.

  35. Bombay, how many all-tourney teams did Duncan Make? How many NCAA Championships? How many times did he lead his team past the Sweet Sixteen, despite Wake Forest being a top five preseason favorite? He achieved less in his first two years than Cody. I’m not at all suggesting that Duncan was an inferior player, or that Cody will necessarily attain Duncan’s level as a pro, but we can cherry pick stats and circumstances– maybe even character traits– all day long. Is your apparent bitter disappointment any better a judge of talent than my hopeless optimism? Nope. Take Duncan at 20, and take Cody at 20. Minus several blocked shots and a few rebounds per game, the two aren’t so different. Is it so impossible to imagine that they might have similar offensive games when all is said and done? Is a year (or more) of ascendance followed by one year of falling short of expectations enough to discount somebody’s future contributions? Ask the Spurs.

  36. Thats the great thing about sports. The proof is in the pudding. We’ll get to see over the course of the next 5 years who is correct. You think Cody Zeller will blossom to the point he rivals the greatest power forward to ever play in the NBA? It will be fun to watch and I can guarantee with almost every bit of my sports knowledge/history that he won’t come close to being Tim Duncan. Its offensive to Duncan to even suggest this “hopeless optimism.” Duncan averaged 21 and 12 his rookie year. He was 2nd team all nba defense as a rookie and won rookie of the year. He was the first overall pick in a good draft. My disappointment with the season has nothing to do with me not thinking Cody is the next Tim Duncan. You comparing Cody to Tim Duncan is a stretch that is far from accurate or fair to either player.

  37. I was easily the dumbest person in the stadium, possibly the town.

    So, what else is new, Your Dimness?

    Tell us something we don’t know.

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