41 comments

  1. Will didn’t get off the bus! Yogi was out played by a freshman and whole team look lost in the second half.
    Hoosier Bob

  2. No mistake, Ennis played extremely well. But it would be unfair to say Yogi got outplayed by him. Yogi played as well as the scheme allowed. He shot it well. He didn’t turn it much considering how much he was relied upon to try to make things happen and how much the ball was in his hands. He saw what happened to his teammates when they went into the packed in zone, and to his credit he didn’t force his way too deep into their length any force shots. The zone doesn’t allow for him to go 1-on-1 and take over the game, so it’s tough to judge him there. Defensively he struggled a bit, but it was as much a team breakdown as it was an individual one.

    Here’s the thing… Against a man defense if the team is just having a terrible night – bad shooting, bad decisions, unlucky bounces, what ever it may be – if you are a guard who has the ball in his hands you can always just try to take over… See if you can provide a spark or make a miracle happen. But against that zone it’s just nearly impossible… especially for someone of Yogi’s size.

    I have no problem being critical of Yogi… I’m glad he’s our PG, but he has yet to crack my top 50 favorite Hoosiers… But I have to give him credit for last night… Only he and Vonleh deserve any. They did what they could, but the team was out-schemed and a few of the other players were shell-shocked.

  3. I had to post this for us Hoosier Fans: A female fan at The Carrier Dome stripped down to her garments, musta bet on the outchttp://extramustard.si.com/2013/12/04/a-hoosiers-fan-stripped-down-to-her-undergarments-during-a-blowout-loss/?xid=ob_blogsome of the game:

  4. My concern: Great coaches make average players great. Crean has to have great players to look his best. If he doesn’t teach them to be team players, then they will be OK but not great. The great players will compete for the NBA draft. They will be more interested in showing their talents, than team plays. Is IU turning into KY? one year and out ball players? Remember how it was last year, Great at the beginning, then he felt he needed to replace some of the starting five with these superstars,the team play concept went away.

  5. John – with all due respect… What are you talking about?

    – There is zero evidence we are turning into UK.

    – Our last one-and-done was Eric Gordon… Under a different coaching staff.

    – Team play was not a problem last year… That was an extremely unselfish team. Not a single player even averaged 10 shots/gm…. In fact nothing was really a problem last year except the 2 things that always are a problem for Crean – Bo Ryan and Jim Boehiem

    – “…replace some of the starting 5 with these superstars…”??? Huh? That literally makes no sense.

  6. John – also please name the last coach that won a national championship (I think that is what we all want) without great players… I’ll wait for your response…. It’s going to take you a while to find it.

  7. John,

    That was oh so wrong. Vic and Sheehey were unheralded HS recruits. Both have developed under Crean and staff. If I have any bitch about Crean and his teams it is he substitutes ferociously and the teams many times each game are way to unselfish. Are we like pUKe? Hell NO! They only thing we have in common with is the Ohio River.

  8. Unfortunately, basketball is not piano class or golf …or tennis…or chess…or pole vaulting….all of which could be scouted for true prodigies with oodles of potential to reach the stars quickly. But, then again, nobody cares much about undiscovered chess players, pole vaulters, piano players, race car drivers…

    Basketball is a team game. I could care less if one name becomes a superstar at the next level at the expense and regression a team game while I watch Indiana remaining stupefied in big games they way for our hyped heroes to take over. Yes, the selected coddled talent certainly gets you exposure…I want exposure for winning big games on the biggest stage.

    Recruiting superstars has nothing to do with teaching and manipulating five on the floor into playing a team game. Bob Knight won three banners with very solid talent. I would only call Isiah Thomas a true “superstar” talent. Many of his players did find relatively short stints in the NBA(struggling to see minutes), but most our college All-Americans never had stellar NBA careers.

    You can teach a lecture hall version of basketball to 300 ballers or you can be a personal tutor to one big-a$$ diamond in the rough while supplying all the inspiration and tools a world class basketball institution and supporting staff. The passion of our fan base would be inspiration enough for many to take their games to new, unimagined heights.

    One superstar can change one or two games, tip the scales and make the clutch plays, on the road of the six match-ups against the best competition in the nation…But to get the big prize, you need a coach that gets the rest to play above their talent. It happens through execution, knowledge, belief, chemistry, adjustments, unselfishness, and a thing called a coach.

    Is it so unusual to discover talent? I find it far more unusual to find a coach that can harness the talent of five to play with the planned and united purpose. A great coach can build a team where each successive weakest link becomes momentary superstar in big games as you witness the less hyped names getting open looks, exploiting a defense, or come up clutch with game-changing, momentum-swinging plays.

    Crean brings a great set of ingredients to the kitchen. A wonderfully developed “Parmigiano-Reggiano” tastes better than Kraft but it won’t build the delicious sauce, the noodles, the selected blends of gently seasoned pork, the right blend of mozzarella and ricotta, and the hand of love and experience that was not only absorbed from
    Grandma Izzo’s wonderful guidance, but applied with the same knack to never forget the details and the importance of each select ingredient.

    Crean is a guy you send with a list to the grocery store. He has a good eye for fresh produce and ripe tomatoes…He knows good cheese. But can he cook like Grandma Izzo? Somehow Tommy just doesn’t get the same results. The ingredients are there. The true hand of a master with all the flavor developing worthy a championship chef?

    I think he was watching Sport Center while grandma was assembling the lasagna.

  9. Except…

    Crean’s teams do play together.

    His teams have proven to be extremely unselfish so far at IU.

    He has beaten Izzo, and almost every other top coach, when he’s had similar, or lesser, talent.

    And when Knight won actual titles or made really deep tournament runs he had elite college talent
    – (76) May, Benson, Wilkerson, Bucker – all 1st round picks…
    – (81) Isiah, Wittman, Tolbert, Turner – all were (or would have been) 1st round picks
    – (87) Alford (2-time AA, B1G POY)

    – (73) your boy Downing!
    – (92) pretty sure Calbert Cheaney is the #1 scorer in the history of the entire conference

    So basically, again, everything you said is completely distorted to fit your agenda.

  10. Nothing is distorted..The only name that was a true and memorable NBA talent was Thomas.

    Crean’s teams TRY to play together….and usually fail on the big stage. There simply isn’t a basic recipe for them to follow and every game is a revolving door of potluck while Crean throws anything and everything in the stew robinson(couldn’t resist, Mr. Name-Dropper).

    I often wonder how it would look if he simply sat his hyper butt in a chair and let a group play for more than a 10 minute stretch. He’s a ‘people pleaser’…He pulls the roast in and out of the oven so frequently to pick and poke and over-season(it makes him appear as a chef that knows what he’s doing), it’s no wonder that nothing can ever cook in a game.

    Of course, Knight recruited top talent. But most were never going to be ‘Magics’..’Michaels’..’Kareems’…of the NBA. And many became All-Americans in college because the success of team and the banners brought additional limelight to the product and the talent.

    Today, most these Rival’s prima donnas and poster boy one-and-done’s, are deemed superstars without the old necessity of earning your spotlight by playing on championship caliber teams that won big games and made deep tournament runs.

  11. May broke his wrist before the ’75 tournament…

    Likely another banner in that season…I think we lost to UK by one point without Scott May.

    ’73 team was robbed at the Final Four by a bogus Establishment call that was whistled by necessity to put the big hyped redhead of Wooden into a championship game.

    Knights teams performed above the talent often with a crafty intellect to succeed when the Establishment was doing everything possible to derail a Knight despised by EAST-WEST press and insiders of the game. Of course, they could never derail him with anything other than horrible officiating because he ran his program to put the concept of student at the forefront.

    Three banners(easily five without untimely injury and a pure Establishment whistle)while doing it with putting education first.

    Out of those three banners, five Final Fours, and ELEVEN Big 10 championships, only one with a legit, long term, NBA talent. And we wonder why scatterbrain longs for a handshake..?

  12. Harv, if your definition of “big stage” is limited to tourney play, you’re selling us way too short. We’ve had plenty of “big stage” moments over the regular season. For every Syracuse or Wisconsin debacle, there’s a UNC blowout, or a legendary win over #1 Kentucky, or any number of wins over highly-ranked Big Ten powerhouses.

    My hope is that Crean has learned his lesson. Few would disagree that we seemed to go into the tourneys with an ill-advised sense of “mission-accomplished” last year; as if we’d already exorcised our demons and achieved what we set out to do. (Not that we shouldn’t be proud of what we DID accomplish– just that it could’ve/should’ve been so much more.) I don’t get the sense that Crean will be coddling anybody in practice any time soon. Not after our last performance. And I don’t get the sense that we’ll be selling ourselves short come March.

    But I find it curious that so many people came into this season with the expectation that our Hoosiers would have an up-and-down year, especially early on given our youth and inexperience, and then seem to be so upset when that turns out to be true. The second -half effort vs ‘Cuse was certainly disheartening, and the Crean substitution patterns still leave me a bit befuddled. But if anything, at times he leaves players in too long. Stan was completely lost and should’ve been taken out before shtuff got out of hand. JH continues to be a turnover machine, and so far has only produced when he’s playing guys with vastly inferior athletic ability. He’s shown that if he can’t get it going early, he probably won’t get it going at all. Why continue to waste possessions with him in there? Sometimes it’s as if Crean has a pre-determined substitution pattern, and no matter how the game’s going, he only strays from that plan if the foul situation dictates he must. It’s by far my biggest gripe.

    Still not ready to write them off yet, though. We’ll never be accused of being a terribly efficient offense this year, but save for one half the effort has been there and the defense at least kept us in games. I expect more of the same, and hope that the shooting comes around.

  13. UNC was without one of their top guards…and was at home.

    The UK win looks “legendary”…but it was also at Assembly. Would it have been legendary on a neutral court or at Rupp?

    I do love the fact that the player whose a$$ had been ridden for two years by many that are casting the same type of “lazy” and “lackadaisical” labels on Hollowell on this blog, was the Hoosier that hit the legendary shot in your legendary game. But didn’t Geoff admit that Terrence Jones was being cast for a ‘Night of the Living Dead’ extra for that game?

    UK and Terrence woke up at a Sweet 16 and our big stars looked more the zombies on the big stage. Much like the Syracuse game last season, we looked tentative and ill-prepared to translate mojo away from Assembly. The man in the suit is soft not beaming with confidence when all other factors equal…and it translates to his team and usurps their belief.

    It’s my opinion. Sorry if you don’t like it. I just don’t think Crean is equipped to adapt and adjust and make his squad feel confident. His system is salesmanship. Creative thinking and implementation of winning strategies is not in his wheel house.

  14. And I did forget about Alan Henderson. North Central product?..or did he go to Brebeuf? I think he was our last really solid post player that stayed within the borders until Cody.

    Knight’s latter years seemed to be always have the asterisk of losing the battle to convince the quality Indiana bigs to wear the cream and crimson.

  15. And for the record…I would have never benched Zeller after the two foul against UK at the Sweet 16. Crean plays everything by his little predictable book. Zeller is not your typical predictable player(not as a freshman..not ever). He had enough savvy to play the entirety(beyond a couple minutes of very selective and quick rest)with four fouls in a first half.

    Crean killed any chance by taking him out of the flow. He was a freshman and we weren’t really supposed to be there anyway. You go with your star and roll the dice. It could have made the difference. We’ll never know because Crean is predictable as setting a pie to bake 75 minutes. But ovens are different and apples don’t all extrude juices the same. Some crusts are more buttery and burn more quickly…He can’t cook. It’s all by the book.

  16. Last really solid player to from Indiana to stay within the borders until Zeller was Alan Henderson?

    Um, no.

    Brian Evans, Jared Jeffries and Eric Gordon.

  17. I think he was our last really solid post player that stayed within the borders until Cody.

    Post player, brainiac. Maybe reading what I write is not in your wheelhouse. Eric Montross..Sean May.

  18. You kiss your mother with that mouth, little lady?

    Indeed you are correct. You’ll have to forgive me for skimming another one of your finely tuned points. Jeffries, at 6’11” played the 5, however. No need to get fresh back, as the spirit of your counterattack still stands. I didn’t read it.

    Man you are an angry, sad, little man.

  19. Glen Robinson(Sr) and Luke Harangody did stay within the borders, but we couldn’t get them in candy-stripes. Seeing how Robinson, Harangody, and McGary are from Northwest Mars, I’m sure they weren’t recruited.

    Add to the list the rest the Zeller’s and Plumlee’s and we’ve nailed down about 1/10 of premier post players from the state between the years of Henderson and Cody.

    And that’s how NC and Duke go deep. Solid coaching, top backcourts, and a force in the middle that has great b-ball intellect and genes.

    Why in the hell do you think nobody could shut up with the “everything hinges on Zeller” blabber?

  20. Sad how your intellect is kinda taking a tank job with the vulgar and crude stuff. Geoff was right..You’re now showing your true worldly colors.

  21. DD is one of our best posters. Davis, Podunker, Geoff, Punjab, HC, among others. This is the best free flowing posts with quality I have seen here in years. I

  22. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, name hijacker.

    Enough with Bawa, Guy-Marc, Tijan, Hanner, and Jurkin projects…How ’bout some Alan Henderson meets Harvey meets a Parsons project? Because nobody wants to be like you, Harvey. Parsons Forever.

  23. I bet the Plumlee parents identify as Hoosiers and their kids as Tarheels… They weren’t ours to lose.

    We did recruit McGary.

    I love hearing your excuses for each of IU’s/Crean’s successes.

  24. Yeah, he recruited McGary and Mr. Whipple doesn’t squeeze the Charmin.

    Unicycle riding free spirited bad-a$$ lumberjack brawler of confidence is about as far from a Jonny Marlin choir boy as one can get.

    He couldn’t recruit McGary because Mitch wouldn’t buy one slice of his preaching bologna. Crean requires guys with a good amount of blind faith.

  25. That’s a hot one. Whenever your attacked, sudden trolls pop up from no where supporting you. You’re one bitter bastard. If I saw you in public, I swear I’d cut you down to size.

  26. You’re so miserable, you make an atheist look like a saint. You have problems. Big problems. You say your mother died holding a cross, (a proud Methodist), yet you have absolutely no respect for the Christian faith. You’re such a scumbag, I bet the atheist pay you to mock the Christian faith. You’re whole family is probably embarrassed of you. Black sheep that nobody wants, associates with, embarrassed about, society issues, holds on to the past, rehashes issues… Yeah, your a dirtbag.

  27. Hope you feel better now, Ben. I’m not into threats. I can say that you wouldn’t be the first to cut me down to size. Faith has forever been a justification for violence and that’s why I don’t cling to it. It divides when it’s put on a platter of superiority. Being born again and saved are excuses for those that live to crap on their neighbor as they walk the earth as flawless creations they believe mirroring their flawless creator.

    I have faith, Ben. I have faith enough to have no need for your version or any that lives in the arrogance of threats and violence and condemnation and condescension and dehumanization and inferior classifications and the plain and ugly piousness that exudes from your lips and those that believe their one faith gives them a right to judge all others no less flawed than the self-righteous blinded by their own image more than any divine and beautiful light.

    I think of children sitting on those airplanes that flew into the twin towers, Ben. I think of the corruption of the mind because of a faith. I wonder why those that can’t accept or live by the beliefs of a neighbor turn to kill the innocent. How can it be acceptable for any faith to take violence as a course of action? I don’t have the answers nor do I have the confidence that faith will ever live on this earth in a humble place not used to stand before another as superior to judge, condemn, cast guilt, or dispose of someone different.

  28. Harvard, at the risk of condemnation, I’d like to say that is very well stated. And while I don’t disagree with a single word you just wrote, it’s unfair to put the entire organized religious experience on that side of the teeter-totter… So while I could present the other side, I thought I might give you a chance to talk about some of the positives. I don’t know if you care, but presenting yourself as more “fair and balanced” on this particular hot-button will probably garner you a little good will.

  29. I wish I had gone to better schools because I have no inkling as to what H4H just posted and I’ve read it twice. ????

  30. Being born again isn’t having all the answers. I sure don’t. We are all broken inside. We all have regrets.

    To say I’m a holy man pointing out people sins, isn’t true. I sin greatly everyday, and ask forgiveness every Sunday at my Methodist church. I’m just as broken as everyone else.

    Does Coach Crean go overboard on the religious tweets? I can’t say that he does, because you can always just unsubscribe to the feed, or just not read at all. That’s what I do. I read some, but when he is on a roll, I just ignore the feed for awhile.

    Some people view the church as a “middle man” to God. For those who had a bad experience in the church, I can understand that. It’s unfortunate, cause their are really many loving and accepting churches in this nation. I’m proud to say my church is as well.

    My point is this. The world don’t revolve around me, Harvard, or an atheist. We all believe in something. Whether you agree with the teachings of Jesus is between you and your “higher power”, but please lay off the Christian mocking.

    1. Once again, people, if you want to debate, fine. Doing so by calling each other scum or dirt bag or what have you? Not fine.

      Also, I think by now we know where Ben stands, and we know where Harvard stands. Let’s be content in that knowledge without either having to further mark their territory, because then it just stinks for everybody.

  31. Hmmm..? Some of the positives?

    1. Tim Tebow is going home.

    2. When I see obnoxiously ostentatious and gaudy churches built the size of football stadiums in what used to be cornfields, I know where not to move.

    3. When everyone else is at church is a good time to hit Dunkin Donuts.

  32. While number 3 is priceless, I was thinking more along the lines of

    charity and volunteer activity…

    Rushing to the aid of people and communities after a disaster…

    Providing a safe environment for kids in some very turbulent areas…

    Clearly these things aren’t unique to organized religion, but they definitely are positives.

  33. Myself and a partner from church run a Disaster Relief ministry. We just formed the team 6 months ago. We plan to stay within a 100 mile radius of Dothan, Alabama. While thankfully we haven’t had any dispatches yet, we are in the second season of tornadoes here in south Alabama, and of coarse hurricane season keeps us on our toes.

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