Hoosier Morning

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Members of the Indiana volleyball team in Vienna. Courtesy IU Athletics.

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IT’S INDIANA

BIG TEN BASKETBALL

BIG TEN FOOTBALL

TAKE A LOOK

Band of Horses’ “Infinite Arms.”

54 comments

  1. Hugh,

    Nice choice with the music (or whoever picked it). You should see them in concert if you can; they put on a helluva live show–although Ben Bridwell’s lack of cowboy hat is disconcerting (perhaps he took it off for this slower tune).

  2. I have not seen Band of Horses live. I would definitely like too. How much do their tickets normally cost? I’ve entered this stage of my music life where I am willing to pay big bucks to see the seminal acts (Springsteen, CSN, Stones, etc …) and five bucks to see a bar band, but have a hard time putting down $30-50 to see a band with one or two good albums.

  3. I think I heard that Noreen had eliminated IU from his list, perhaps due to scholarships.

  4. Crean and McClain in their infinite wisdom thought Michel and his 7 pts and 7 rbs in JUCO was better than Noreen, who averaged close to 40 pts and 17 rebounds a game. The guy is a horrible judge of talent. See Jobe and Bawa.

  5. Wasn’t the whole Noreen thing just a miscommunication?? Didn’t they just accidentally get the dates switched? Hilarious. Really.

  6. Noreen is a light weight playing in the lowest HS class competition available in Minnesota. He will need the two years Guy will be here to bulk up to the rigors of the B10.

  7. 4 guards ive been listening to your yip yap about things you obviously hv no clue about. Noreen though a big time scorer in class A… is a major project due to the fact that he has no weight on him…he hides behind street poles . We need beef up front not a project that we hav to wait until he finishes 2 years of pizza and buffet training….as for tijan…crean needed bodies…bawa either steps up or hes gone….dont b a crean basher…he has the best intrest for iu….

  8. Let’s talk about infinite wisdom. Refer to the discussion of last week concerning Scout vs. Rival ranking of IU potential players.

    1. As stated, 4guards played AAU ball with Odle.
    2. Cheaney’s last year with IU was 92-93.
    3. Odle’s last year with IU was 01-02.
    4. That’s a 9 year age difference.
    5. That puts 4guards in 4th grade when Cheaney graduated from Evansville Harrison.

    4guards speaks as if he is all knowing, must have been a very bright 4th grader to evaluate Cheaney’s abilities at Harrison.

  9. Millport,
    First off, it was a summer league and not AAU.
    I was too young to remember at the time, but I also know how to research and also talk to knowledgeable people who are old enough to remember first hand.

  10. Gmoney,
    Michel is a bigger project than Noreen so your philosophy makes no sense.
    As for Tijan, Crean needed bodies, but there were much better solutions than Jobe. This is IU for crying out loud.

  11. Hugh,

    I caught BoH last August in Louisville. I think tix were $16 (the show sold out and people were paying $30 for scalped tix). It was well worth the $16 I paid, and even $30 would’ve been a good price. They bring an enormous amount of enthusiasm to the stage, and it is infectious. They are showmen extraordinaire and they know how to read an audience. I go to a lot of concerts (Bloomington, Indianapolis, Chicago, Cincinnati, St. Louis)–mostly of indie bands like BoH–and they put on a top-five performance.

  12. Hugh,

    P.S. Don’t go see BoH open for Pearl Jam … those tickets, after the “convenience fees” are over $50 … not worth it for a past-their-prime-by-more-than-a-decade band like PJ playing in a big venue. Try to catch them at a nice-sized venue like The Bluebird, The Bishop, or even the Buskirk-Chumley Theater. (Btw, Bluebird and Bishop bring in good bands and the shows are cheap.)

  13. Well your research of Chaney failed you. Probably all the important people you know and their mythical conversations you have with them provided opinions and not facts. As you said you were to young to have any recall with accuracy, although your negative bias comes through accurately. There is the possibility Chet, Millport and I know what we are talking about and needed to do no research because we were IU fans at the time of his recruitment. I certainly remember it and correctly so.
    Talk about hit a wall. In his Freshman year Noreen’s frailness would have wore down faster than Pritchard did. Noreen probably will fit well in the MW.

  14. IUFan, I paid only 80 bucks with fees to see Pearl Jam a couple of weeks ago. It was a very powerful concert. In fact it was the best concert I have ever been to for the money. Vedder played 2 full encores of 5 and 6 songs. I would not say they are past their prime at all. Just my opinion anyway.

  15. Soon it will be summertime…I don’t want to see some sad hillbilly trying to do his B-rate version of Neil Young in a cloudy bar…He did whistle nicely.

    I want happy tunes..I want short shorts in high-heeled shoes…I want the Beach Girl 5!

  16. IUfanPurduePhD-

    While there is no sense in arguing about taste, you are downright crazy calling Pearl Jam “past their prime.” Eddie Vedder’s voice is better at 45 years old than most 25 year olds. Robert Plant couldn’t sing an octave up after age 30 and yet Eddie can still evoke chills with his screams.

    You must have not heard “Backspacer” either.

    The only comments more ludicrous than the one you just made is the daily jibber-jabber coming from 4tards’ drooling muzzle.

  17. Well I guess we will just agree that he was one of the lesser known recruits in that class and was not highly rated at time of signing… and disagree on his pre injury ranking.

  18. JPat-

    I am totally jealous you got to go to the show (I’m assuming the one in Noblesville). I almost don’t want to know how good it was, since I had to work that evening. I peeked at the set list on line and it looks like they had an awesome lineup of songs; a good mixture of new and old.

    I am crossing my fingers that when they return from Europe in July, they will do a show in Chicago or Louisville so I can catch them on the back end of their tour.

  19. Pearl Jam closing Lollapalooza at Grant Park a few years ago was among the most amazing things I’ve seen. Considering the run up of bands that led to that set — My Morning Jacket, Kings of Leon — I doubt there will be many nights that can top it.

    We hit the Bishop on Friday night while celebrating Mr. Dopirak’s birthday. Good vibe in there.

  20. Can’t believe I’m about to get into this, but here goes…

    “Backspacer” wasn’t bad, but did you listen to the rest of their releases over the past 10 years? (Binaural, Riot Act, Self-Titled) Bad. Prettay, prettay, prettay, prettay bad. Their best album, “Ten,” came out almost 20 years ago. That album was the high watermark of their career; thus, they are past their prime. I didn’t say they were terrible, but $80 could’ve purchased several tickets to other concerts with bands that are in their prime. Pearl Jam was a very influential bands of the ’90s, but their recent works are no longer affecting the musical landscape. Bands from that era (80s and 90s) can still put on good shows and charge tons of money, but that doesn’t mean they’re sonically relevant (e.g. U2, Smashing Pumpkins, Metallica, etc.)

    That’s the last I’ll say on the matter.

  21. Ha ha, ok, one last thing: if you paid $80 for a PJ show and they only played songs from their last four albums, would you be disappointed? … That should be the measure of if a band is past their prime or not.

  22. It’s too bad we are talking about musical taste, because none of the phrases you have used such as “best,”, “musical prime,” and “influential on the music scene” are applicable, objective measures of the quality of a band. They all come from opinions. This isn’t like looking at basketball stats.

    For example, who the hell says “Ten” is their default “best album”? “Vs.” was absolutely majestic and was my favorite album. Many people feel the same way. “Ten” was great, but there is no definitive criteria that makes one “better than the other. And please, don’t use album sales and “influence on other musicians” as qualifiers. Wal Mart is very influential on other businesses, and McDonalds sells a boatload of burgers.

    You are right, IMO, that much of their work of the last 10 years is ho-hum. But Zeppelin and the DOors had weaker albums, too. Fact is, their first 4 albums (Including “No Code”) were some of the best of all-time in American rock. Add in Eddie’s solo work on the Sean Penn movie, and a mega-renaissance in BackSpacer (which is nothing less than spectacular, except for two songs), and PJ is still #1 in my opinion.

    I’m out, as Jim Rome says.

  23. I guess it is all opinion in the end but I loved Vs, Vitalogy, Yield and I listen to the Lost Dogs Cd set a lot. The concert was great for me! I have loved the band since late 8th grade and have never had the opportunity to see them live. I would have paid well over 80 bucks and it is Verizon and their fees that hurt, tickets were only 22 a piece.

    Husky and Korman, I was in the restroom in midstream when Vedder starts singing one of my favorites, “Release”. I cut myself off and ran in to watch. For a band that some think is past their prime, it looked sold out and every campground around and hotel was booked…they have quite the following. I wish I had a few less drinks so I could remember more…the one thing that will stick with me is when the crowd sang parts of the elderly woman behind the counter.

  24. JPat- I love “Release.” I would have cut myself off in the urinal, too. Were you on the lawn or in the seats? That would be one concert where I’d pay to be up front. Nothing ruins a good concert than sitting with a bunch of unruly high school kids on the lawn, i.i., my experience at the Tom Petty concert a few years back.

    Every band has fans and detractors. All I ever hear about PJs live shows are that they are second-to-none. Korman’s experience helps corroborate that. I can’t wait to go to one. I’m a Seattlite and I am ashamed to say I’ve never seen them live.

    On another note, a friend of mine’s daughter plays on Eddie Vedder’s daughter’s softball team, and she says at the games, Eddie’s baseball cheers have the same baritone vibrato as his singing voice. Funny stuff.

  25. I saw Ben Folds Five at Deer Creek(before it was renamed to Verizon)…They were opening for a group called Foo Fighters. I also so Tina Turner perform at Deer Creek. She was fun….Paula Cole and Train at the Murat Center….Steve Miller Band at Assembly Hall. Styx played at my high school before they made the Equinox album. That’s about it…I think.

    She’s a brick and I’m downing downing….

  26. Tom, I was in the lawn about halfway back in the middle. I was worried about that but everyone around was fine. I do think there was more weed than booze in and out of the venue! To those who read this for IU stuff only like I do 99% of the time, sorry we got off track!

    PS: Catch them if you can, from what I am reading and saw in person they are really putting on extra special shows on this tour.

  27. 4guards,

    Did you really compare the high school stats of a Class A player with the stats of a college player?

    I don’t think Michel will be making the All-Big Ten team, but you left out some important details — like the fact that Michel’s numbers were generated by his average of 20 minutes per game. Say he gets stronger and better conditioned this summer, and ends up playing more than 20 minutes a game at IU (hey, ya never know with this team) — he may put up better numbers.

    The other fact you left out is that Noreen put up those ridiculous numbers against poor competition — which probably means he’s a slightly above average player who will get manhandled for his first couple of college season due to his lack of strength and experience vs. top notch competition.

  28. “IUfan/PurdouchePhD” yes, thank you for staying classy Mr. AdHominem.

    Husky, like it or not, the world of [artful] music isn’t shaped by stats (like basketball). Sales do not equal cultural value (lest Avatar and Titanic be the two best movies of all time). So, in turn, opinions count for more in the world of art than they do in sports because sports can be quantified (scoreboard), while art has no scoreboard. Thus, when you look at people who are paid to analyze music for a living, they don’t think much of Pearl Jam’s last decade of work. In an effort to quantify it, you can see that they only made one year-end top ten list–and that came from Billboard.

    I’m not saying they’re past their prime as far as performance goes, but “performance prime” is a very different thing than “recording prime.” With a catalog as large as theirs, PJ is allowed a throwaway album, but I’m not the only one that thinks they haven’t produced a significant work since 1998’s “Yield” U2 hit their performance prime in the last decade, but their discography over the past decade is far from noteworthy.

  29. Michel could play the entire game for a JV team and not put up 40 points a game. I don’t care what his competition is , he is not skilled enough to do so.
    Why do you think he only played 20 minutes a game in JUCO?
    Do you really think he is going to get more minutes for IU playing in the Big 10 than he did at a JUCO out in Idaho? Give me some of that Kool-Aid. You seem to drink enough of it.

  30. (You’ll get no argument from me that Lafayette is lacking in arts appreciation behind Bloomington, which is why I go to Chicago, Indy, Btown, Louisville, Nashville, Cincy, and St. Louis to catch good bands… But just because I live in Lafayette doesn’t mean I don’t have a good appreciation of thoughtful, quality art. Forgive me for not recognizing the epic highbrow nature of Pearl Jam … I completely forgot about the cultural impact of their megahit song “Last Kiss”)

  31. 4guards,

    I don’t know why he only played 20 minutes. Perhaps there was an older, more skilled, more experienced center playing in front of him?

    And if you read back in my post, I never claimed Michel was more skilled than Noreen. I just think it’s asinine to throw up Noreen’s super-inflated numbers from the lowest possible class of basketball in a non talent-rich state, as if it provides any feasible indication of how he’ll translate as a college player.

    Think about it this way — put Noreen in Indiana. Even in Indiana Class A, he’d score less than what he did in Minnesota Class A (so, under 40). I don’t think it’s a stretch to say that. Now put him in Indiana Class 5A — what does he score then? That’s a four-class jump, so let’s say he averages HALF of what he’d be averaging in Class A — so something like 16 or 18 points per game.

    THEN — project that onto his college game. All of a sudden, you have a guy who, in his first year or two, will probably average the same amount of points, and maybe even less blocks (because of his underwhelming physical stature) than Michel. Meanwhile, Michel has the potential to make a solid impact, and then his scholarship will be available in only two years.

    If you’re saying Michel’s game will get worse as he moves up only one level, then apply that same logic to Noreen. He’s going from Class A ball in a non-basketball state to Division One NCAA basketball. That’s a much bigger jump than JUCO to NCAA.

    Once again, try being consistent in how you apply your “logic.” That’s all anyone here asks.

  32. Some think the reason the last 2 or 3 albums were not received as well was because Bush was in office. Vedder was so angry it messed up his creativity and Bush secretly told folks not to buy their albums. Coincidence that their latest album is getting good to great reviews since Obama is in office…I think not!!! hahahahahaha

    On a serious note I love that they have stayed the same and have not sold out like so many other bands. They could have changed style and sound to sell more albums and promoted in much different ways but they stayed on their path!

    IUFan, after arguing the point I am thinking you are not that big a PJ fan which is cool. What are your fav bands???

  33. J Pat,

    Ha ha, that’s a pretty serious Bush conspiracy theory. 🙂 I don’t think the ex-prez had to do much to dissuade people from buying those albums (I bought Riot Act and immediately regretted it).

    You surmised correctly: I not a big PJ fan … I *was* a big fan in the ’90s. But they turned me off from 2000-2008, so I moved on (9 years is a long time to settle for mediocrity).

    A few of my favorite artists: Andrew Bird, Sufjan Stevens, Horse Feathers, The Black Keys, The Strokes, Radiohead, Sigur Ros, The Avett Brothers, Patrick Watson, Plants & Animals, Ryan Adams, Ratatat, The National, Bon Iver, Band of Horses, Blitzen Trapper, and 2003-2007 Kings of Leon (before they sold out) … to name a few. 🙂

  34. (You can tell it’s a slow [sports] news day when Pearl Jam gets as much attention as IU basketball … and it’s mostly my fault. Also, sorry about those stupid smiley faces, not sure why they showed up as emoticons. *frown*)

  35. IUfan, I am not familiar with most of the bands you mention. Since having young children my sports and music knowledge have suffered. Too bad you gave up on PJ. Vedder has had me all along with his vocals…as far back as Temple of the Dog and of course Ten! Give the new album a chance. Have a great night!!!

  36. JPat,

    No worries man, most of those bands are obscure and not present in the mainstream. I’m a bachelor and so I’ve got the time/money to invest/research into new bands–I buy about 2 albums per month, and go to about 1 concert per month… so I kinda make it my goal to stay on top of things (w/o wife & kids), and it’s a great distraction from my dissertation work.

    Not knowing your taste outside of PJ, I would definitely recommend The Black Keys, Band of Horses, Blitzen Trapper, and Spoon … they are the most normal-ish rock that I’m into. (The Black Keys will melt your face off if you see them live … RAWK!)

  37. IUfan- It doesn’t take much for me to break decorum on this blog, and for that I apologize. Your doctor-like aura (even though you are still ABD) has convinced me that even though you dislike PJ, at least your feeling is substantiated. That being said, I still think you should give Backspacer a few more listens through. It took me a while to embrace it. E.V.’s voice has aged incredibly, and the band continues to evolve around him.

    I have heard many of the bands you mentioned to JPat, and appreciate their musical sensibility, I sadly confess that I am one of those curmudgeouns who can’t appreciate much of anything new. My taste for rock peaked with PJ and Alice and Chains, and I’d still pull out a Doors record before listening to the Black Keys, the White Stripes, or Radiohead (I’ve heard Kings of Leon and, putting the “sellout” question aside, I think the dude has a fantastic voice).

    All in all, I’ll end where I began: there’s no sense in arguing about taste. I feel like one of the central qualities of art is precisely that it resists our attempts to impose organizational categories, scales, and hierarchies of high and low that govern so much of the rest of our modern experience. In the end, to the accusation “that music sucks!,” we can always throw back a “No, it doesn’t!” with a certain sense of conviction and dignity. This means that “Anciens” like myself worry less about our old-fashioned tastes being invalidated by the “Modernes.”

    Catch you next time.

  38. Husky T,

    Hopefully, by this time next year, ABD will be a thing of the past. 🙂 (And no, I won’t change my username to Dr.IUfan … that’s just pretentious.)

    Sadly, there is some *fantastic* music out there, but it’s not getting much–if any–press or airtime outside of niche markets within the indie arena. The internet has balkanized the music landscape, but while today’s popular music is mostly ear-bleedingly bad, there are a number of great bands lurking under the surface. (While you resist the highbrow/lowbrow labels, they still remain, and they serve a purpose; there’s no way anybody could convince me that Nickelback’s lyrics are in the same league as a lyrical masters like Sufjan Stevens or Andrew Bird.)

    Your preference for decades-old Alice in Chains albums over fresh tunes from The Black Keys made me shed a tear on the inside, but I’m not going to yell anything like, “They suck!” You’re right, that kind of stuff is pointless (and, for the record, I’m not anti-Alice in Chains). And I also agree with you that Eddie Vedder has a great voice; one of the reasons “Elderly Woman Behind a Counter…” is one of my favorite PJ songs is because his voice is so prominent.

    I’m sorely tempted to go on a mini-lecture about the importance of Radiohead’s “OK Computer,” I’ll spare you. But I can assure you that I have an appreciation for the music of self-proclaimed “Ancients” … In fact, one of the courses for which I’ve been a teaching assistant at Purdue is “Society, Culture, and Rock & Roll,” so you could even call it a professional pastime. I own all the Beatles records, most Stones records, a few Doors, etc. (I was practically weened on Van Morrison … now *that* guy has an awesome voice.)

    Most importantly, we can agree to cheer for IU basketball (Purdue my sign my paychecks, but the only time I would ever root for them is if they played UK). Takereasy, dude.

  39. IUfan- don’t have the time for a well thought-out response, but I appreciate the insights. Rest assured that I “respect” Radiohead as musicians; there is simply a part of me that categorically rejects the “British melancholy” sound (I feel like there are too many songs in minor keys with lots of emotional falsettos) no matter how good the artist is… Coldplay, The Cure, Morrisey, etc.

    And I couldn’t agree more about your Nickelback assessment…whenever I need to make a joke about “mass culture” music, Nickelback is my punchline, even though my wife is from Vancouver.

    In regards to your last few words:
    “Takereasy, she’s my lady, she’s my lady and that’s what I…. hey that one was kind of? No?”

    Does that ring a bell?

  40. IUfan, I am not familiar with most of the bands you mention. Since having young children my sports and music knowledge have suffered.

    JPat-

    Your honesty is refreshing..music to more ears than you probably know. The self-appointed doctorates of entitlement now forever the hip crowd writers for Rolling Scoop magazine were nauseating to a near gag reflex degree. Did you know “studies indicate that up to one-third of healthy people do not have a gag reflex”(courtesy: Wikipedia). I’m just thankful the diversionary topic wasn’t pruning fruit trees.

    Cheering for IU while living in Lafayette? What a twisted sister.

  41. Terry, thanks man. I am right from the heart on everything. Sure a lot of these people would run to old wicky-pedia for stuff/stats and try to blow smoke on everything from sports to music…I am not that guy on here or in person. Here is to honesty and integrity!!!

    after writing that I will listen to Dissident by none other than Pearl Jam…

  42. Husky T,

    I’m very curious about that last line … nothing rang a bell. Even a bottle of Sioux City Sarsaparilla didn’t bring anything to mind.

    Agreed, Nickelback is an easy punching bag–almost too easy… but I’m sure another terrible rock band will reach superstardom soon enough.

  43. IUFan-

    I thought that you might have been quoting this. It’s an old classic – watch it if you have time. It’s an old SNL video. Will Ferrell plays the devil, who visits Garth Brooks one evening to try to help him write songs. Funny stuff. The band Smashmouth comes up at one point, speaking of crappy music.

  44. Ah-ha! That’s one of my favorite SNL skits, it’s just been a long, long time since I’ve seen it (5, 6 years? … whenever “Best of Will Ferrell” came out on DVD). Alas, I was quoting Sam Elliot’s character from The Big Lebowski (which is why I mentioned the sarsaparilla in my last comment; I thought about going with Caucasian/White Russian instead).

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