Hoosier Morning

Indiana coach Tom Crean and Jordan Hulls talk on the bench during Sunday’s game against Iowa. David Snodgress | Herald-Times

STARTING FIVE

1. A RECORD RUN

Andy Bayer ran the fasted 3,000-meter run of the year last weekend, possibly setting his career on a new path, Dustin wrote.

2. INDIANA BASKETBALL

Indiana Daily Student columnist Nathan Hart evaluated Indiana without Verdell Jones, where the next win may come from and the transfer rumors started by Dan Dakich and Don Fischer.

Eric Gordon will be out several weeks for the Los Angeles Clippers after injuring his wrist, the Los Angeles Times’ Lisa Dillman wrote.

3. BIG TEN BASKETBALL

With a flurry of 3-pointers and a feisty defense, Ohio State absolutely steamrolled Purdue, the Columbus Dispatch’s Bob Baptist wrote. Purdue simply did not come to play on the defensive end, the Lafayette Journal & Courier’s Jeff Washburn wrote.

With Iowa coming to town, Penn State is trying to focus not on what could have been last week, but what it can do this week, the Daily Collegian’s Alex Angert wrote. The youth movement at Iowa is paying dividends, the Cedar Rapids Gazette’s Scott Dochterman wrote.

Minnesota’s three freshmen have been pressed into duty by the injury to Al Nolen, the Minneapolis Star-Tribune’s Myron P. Medcalf wrote.

The big news of the day was off the court, with Michigan State dismissing Korie Lucious for the rest of the season, the Lansing State Journal’s Joe Rexrode wrote.

Here are the updated Big Ten standings.

4. BIG TEN FOOTBALL

Northwestern appears set to hire former Indiana assistant head coach Dennis Springer, the Chicago Tribune’s Teddy Greenstein wrote.

Twelve Iowa players were hospitalized after their bodies reacted to a strenuous workout, the Des Moines Register reported.

5. ONE FOR THE ROAD

Cold War Kids’ “Mine is Yours.”

31 comments

  1. I’m with Dak and Fish on this one. People view transfers as a bad thing, but there are a number of guys here who were originally Sampson recruits that just don’t have what it takes to play and win in the Big Ten.

    Pritchard
    Capobianco
    Maybe Roth?

    I wouldn’t miss any of these guys and it would free up some scholarships for more deserving recruits/transfers.

    Crean is starting to work on borrowed time. Fans are tired of losing, even if we all know that this team has had some challenges out of its control this year. They NEED to get help for Cody Zeller fast.

  2. I’ll be very interested to see what this offseason brings for this squad.

    Crean did have a number of transfers at Marquette. From the research I did last year for Korman I had it at about 13 for his entire tenure. Interestinlgy enough, his entire Freshman recruiting class from 2003-2004 eventually jumped ship. That included Dameon Mason who ended up at LSU.

    The makeup of this team will most likely be different than this year. Over under on 2 new JUCO’s enterting the fray after the transfers sort themselves out? It may not be a bad thing as Dan and Fish elaborated on in their talk.

    PB

  3. I don’t want to strike the wrong chord here and act like I’m supporting or not supporting the idea of pushing certain players to transfer, but I’m interested in seeing where this discussion goes if it really gets specific. So again, everything that follows is just for the sake of argument.
    But I think one major issue Crean obviously has to consider if he decides to push people to transfer is how exactly he’s going to replace them at this stage of the game.
    I’d venture to guess that if we took a poll (and I’m not quite keen on that at this point) the top two players most would put on the transfer list would be Capobianco and Pritchard, which is understandable considering they’ve committed a combined 85 fouls and scored 57 points.
    But my question is, can you really afford to get rid of BOTH of them? Lose them both, and you have just one player on your roster — Derek Elston — who has played center, and it’s more than a little evident that he’s not all that comfortable there. That makes him really foul prone, so if you get rid of Pritchard and Capobianco, you probably need not one but two ready-to-play centers to take their place.
    There are only 13 uncommitted players still available in the Rivals.com Top 150. Just two of those — Angelo Choi of San Diego and Desmond Hubert from New Jersey — are listed as centers. Obviously, Rivals isn’t the end-all, be-all, but centers tend to catch the attention of recruiting services fairly easily. Obviously, the JUCO route is an option, but those grounds aren’t quite as fertile now that prep school has become the prevailing option for those just short of qualification at the end of high school. In other words, the players they would need at this juncture don’t grow on trees.
    What do you all think? For all their struggles, can IU really afford to cast both Pritchard and Capobianco aside?

  4. Wow. Did some of you sports buffs notice how tough Colorado played #6 Kansas last night? Wasn’t that Colorado squad a cupcake team when we played them in Vegas? And did anyone notice Purdue being about 30 points down to OSU for most of the game last night? Albeit it was at Columbus, but still. We played OSU in front of a very flat home crowd during Christmas break(hardly any different than a neutral site when the students aren’t in town). OSU couldn’t miss from the 3-point line against us and we still looked more competitive than #12 Purdue.

    We have some very winnable home games left on the Big 10 schedule, folks. I like every scholarship player on our roster and I personally think it’s unfair to be packing their luggage for a couple bad outings. Very low class to be bringing up Sampson’s name for the purposes of creating negative feelings toward some players. This team has had some hard hits to their roster. Wish we could show some fans the door(e.g. Dan Crotchitch). Dakich suffers from a severe case of ratmouth disease for being passed over for the head coaching position. His basketball skills during his playing days at IU garnered far less attention his big mouth. Nice to see his sliminess can earn him a paycheck.

  5. Hmmm?

    Is Ratliff ready to finally see some action?

    Will Malik Story’s scoring average ever exceed his shoe size?

  6. Dustin-
    Why would Tom Pritchard transfer, if he was going to do that he’d do it last year. Its not like he takes a lot of shots or has a role that will change with the acquisition of Zeller. His only reason to transfer would be because he no longer enjoys being coached by Crean. But next year is Pritchard’s last year. He’ll be valuable for defending Cody in practice and backing him up in the games. Tom transferring would really surprise me, he’ll take a page out of JRivers’ book and just put his head down and take the high road. Capo to me appears to not really care about anything basketball related; I think he enjoys what comes with being a bball player at IU, the campus things. But he is absolutely not a B1G basketball player, and I don’t think that bothers him. He’ll transfer and play somewhere else but it won’t be because of his own doing, hopefully Crean gives him the ‘see ya’. Watford should move on, I think for he and Crean both. Crean wants tough, hard nosed players and that just isn’t Watford at all. They might stick it out together but it’ll be because we have to have someone stay so it might as well be Watford. I never thought Elston would transfer but he’s gotta be thinking about it at this point. He has basically wasted 2 years at IU and I can’t imagine he’s a major factor in future plans with this team, especially if they want to really start winning again. I also didn’t think Creek would either but if he does I don’t think anyone can blame him, all he’s seen at IU is losing and injuries, not fun for anyone. Roth hopefully does, for his sake, he could easily play at a Bradley or Valpo and get 10 shots a game and average double figs, especially if he gets a redshirt and has 2 years left, it’d be worth it for him. The funny thing is that Malik Story and Nick Williams are both playing well and they are both players who IU fans wouldn’t mind having right about now….

  7. Waka Flocka,
    I wasn’t suggesting at all that he would do it by his own choice. I’m obviously not saying that I know for certain Crean is looking to ship him elsewhere either, but there was discussion on the radio between Dakich and Fischer saying that there are players who can’t hang in the Big Ten and should be told by Crean after the season ends, ‘Congratulations, I just got off the phone with Ball State, you can be a Cardinal if you want.’ I would think that if you told IU fans that would happen, the first two names they would suggest for such a fate would be Capobianco and Pritchard. I’m not saying that’s fair or unfair, but considering the statistics, it’s understandable. I’m also saying I’m not sure you can afford to discard both. That’s sort of the discussion. If you’re Crean and you have decided you want to go the route of nudging players out the door, who can you nudge out and who can you not afford to chance losing?

  8. I am as disappointed an IU fan as anyone else, and have given basically my tickets away for every game. But…..it just gives me a bad feeling to think that a kid is promised a college education and then it is taken away from them. This isn’t employement where they have to meet a yearly performance evaluation or be fired. If this is what college basketball has become, the game has lost its appeal to me. Bob Knight on Mike and Mike today was right. The one-and-doners at Kentucky and Ohio state really have ruined the game. Call me old school–I am.

  9. I think if anyone transfer out of the whole team, it’s Capo. That’s it. Pritchard will be a senior, and transferring for one year would be silly. I think as up and down as Elston has been, he can be a valuable member of this team, especially when bigger guys arrive and he can play at his natural position. Remember, he is a sophomore playing against guys that are 3 and 4 inches taller than him. Also, I doubt Roth transfers. People tend to forget that Roth played three games last season. He, similar to Creek, has to find his way back. Scoring fourteen points (albeit on 12 three point attempts) looks like a step in the right direction to me.

  10. I’m sure you know your blogging name sounds like WTF. It’s very clever. Isn’t there a board game…?..Mad Gab? I bet you really didn’t have any idea where the former Hoosiers were at or how they were playing..Forgotten Hoosiers until this true Hoosier fan jogged your memory. LOL. You’re welcome, WhatTheFloka.

    Run for the hills, Hoosiers! Run..run…Transfer one…Transfer all! Soylent Green is Tom Crean sunscreen!…Soylent Green is Tom Crean sunscreen!…. specially bottled by Izzo at an undisclosed warehouse in East Lansing …Transfer one..transfer all…It’s doomsday at Assembly Hall!

    Dustin is turning transfer rumor into transfer “situation”? WTNudgin’ flocka is going on around here? Have you all gone wacko again? Let the damn season play out.

  11. Dustin- yes I saw/read all that stuff; yeah I don’t know, as far as what you can afford- I don’t think wins/losses would be affected much either way. Look at this years team, they aren’t good. Its not like there are any players other than Hulls, Oladipo, Sheehey, who IU fans/Crean would be heartbroken if they left. If Crean has other options or feels like he wants to go in another direction or ‘nudge’ someone, I don’t see how the last 2 years worth of performances could be used to say “oh no, not him, don’t push him out.” (Regarding whichever player)Plus if Crean did go that route I think IU fans would be fine with it if (and you’d have to assume this is the only reason he would do it) the players who fill the open spots are better.

    The real telling problem with this group is that there are less players whom IU fans want to see back(3 maybe 4?)than there are who IU fans wouldn’t mind seeing go some place else (6-7)

    *also if Creek does move on, Oladipo probably does too, Creek was the major reason Vic ever came to IU

  12. Shoe Size = IQ,

    Not sure what you are talking about here; if you think that people don’t know that Malik went to Nevada and that Nick is playing at Ole Miss you are mistaken.

    If you think that being a ‘true fan’ means you go down with the ship then enjoy that. If you were a true fan of water, you’d drink the water even if you knew it was poisoned? You’d be a true fan of that water wouldn’t you Shoe….way to go buddy…..but some ‘true fans’ like to think

  13. Wacka,
    I think you’re right when you say that there aren’t too many that fans would be devastated to see leave, but I guess my point in even bringing up the discussion is to say that if they saw their available options for next year, they might think otherwise. Obviously Crean has done a fine job of recruiting, and you would be thrilled to give up Tom Pritchard if it meant an open scholarship for another Hanner Perea. But there almost certainly is not another Hanner Perea still available in the 2011 class. There are certainly finds out there to be had, but I think if you liquidated the roster now and presumed you could exchange all the bad talent for better talent immediately, you would be grossly overselling what’s available to join the squad immediately. There’s obviously a lot left in 2012 and beyond, and it would be in Crean’s best interest to clear out space for it. But clearing out a lot of this group and hoping to replace it for next season might leave him with even bigger holes than he already has.

  14. Rumors from out of IU from Gary Parrish is Watford and Creek might transfer at the end of the year

    Since no one is paying attention to this valid resource

  15. Dustin-I agree with what you are saying. I don’t know if I believe in all the ‘nudge transfer’ talk though. But if it did happen maybe it’d be for no more of a reason then simply “why go through it again.” With regards to Capo, Pritch, Elston, etc. Whether good/bad came from it would be besides the point. Lets be honest, a few of our players who get 20+ mins are getting those by default. The bigs had already been ‘replaced’ with GMM but that obviously didn’t pan out for Crean…But yes I am agreeing with you, but I also don’t know how much I think Crean is just going to nudge people out. He’ll probably make a pretty thoughtful decision after looking at a lot of different angles, not just ‘disappointment on the court.’

  16. Why would watford leave the program? He gets the ball. He takes all the shots he wants to. If he is so good than why isn’t he putting this team on his shoulders and winning some games? He is predicted to be in the mock draft his senior year….and the next two years are going to be much easier than the first 2.

  17. DD,

    You truly aren’t just another pretty face. Your research on who in the top 150 is available and any JC options supports your line of thinking about the big men going forward, indeed establishes a complicated conundrum for Coach Crean. The decision about adjustments adding to the “11” class will be ripe for speculation, second guessing and reporting. I kind of think he sticks tight being patient, reacting as it develops before him.

  18. I think everybody should calm down! What do you think this is – a “Season on the Brink?”

    I say that facetiously, but it serves a purpose: Does anyone remember the year 1985-6? It may sound familiar if you go back and read the book, which describes all the agony that IU went through before Alford and crew won the national title in 86-87!

    People were in despair about the team and ready to throw the then coach (whose initials were “RMK”) to the wolves. Alford was too small and this and that and the other thing — and then, lo and behold, one year later, they won the National Title!

    Suddenly, all is forgiven and forgotten.

    “Season on the Brink” chronicles some of the agony that preceded the ecstasy. Usually the agony is generated after a loss, and usually the bad losses are on the road.

    Give these guys a year of growing stronger, good health and repair of the injuries that have plagued the team, and an injection of some new blood and they might turn things around significantly. I’m not saying they’re going to win the national title next year, and there are certainly many many factors playing into it all, but…

    I can see maybe one or twole of players who might be best served by transferring – to get some playing time, etc. But I wouldn’t count Watford, Creek or even Pritchard (who is a REALLY solid defensive player playing out of position in my humble opinion) among them.

    And I think a lot of this talk is pretty silly.

    It is all part of the growing process.

    And the furor is all part of the media process.

    Calm down!

  19. I’ll got back to this discussion we had back in March of 2010. Just thought it would be worthwhile to re-examine and throw out there.

    (From Thursday, March 11, 2010 -)

    PB
    Friday, March 12, 2010 – 4:10 PM EST

    GFDave,

    Did some research on Crean’s transfers while he was at Marquette a few weeks ago. It was a bit interesting.

    Transfers School Year
    Krunti Hester Lamar University 2000
    Odartey Blankson UNLV 2002
    Ron Howard Valpo 2002
    Kevin Menard Carthage College (DIII) 2002
    Karon Bradley Wichita State 2004
    Brandon Bell Detroit Mercy 2004
    Carlton Christian Unknown 2004
    Andy Freund UW- Whitewater 2004
    James Matthews Iowa State 2004
    Dameon Mason LSU 2005
    Ryan Amoroso San Diego State 2006
    Matt Mortensen Kicked off team 2006
    Anthony Green Academically ineligble 2007

    (My response to Hoosier Clarion chiming in about how the amount of transfers above isn’t that abnormal.)

    Hoosier Clarion,

    Yeah, I agree almost 1 per a year is not that big of a deal. Crean’s also probably not going to ever have a 2004-2005 max exodus thing again. You have to figure he’s applied lessons learned going forward to his future recruiting efforts.

    Being from the Chicago area I never really understood the whole Dameon Mason (West Aurora product) transfer. He had a great first two years with the Golden Eagles, averaged 30 min per game and was on the verge of blowing up his Junior year. Some saw him as the next Dwayne Wade. After he went to LSU he didn’t really amount to much of anything but a role player.

    It would be like Watford transferring after two solid years at IU. Weird.

    Anyway, take it easy,
    PB

    BTW is GFDave still around, haven’t heard him in a while?

  20. Dustin,

    You suggest Pritchard as one of the guys fans might not mind seeing transfer. Your reasoning is because he’s committed a lot of fouls and doesn’t score much. Tom is a role player in a system that seldom feeds him the ball or looks to him to score. He is a solid defender and his defense is what has kept us in a number of games this year. As for all the fouls, a good number of them are from when he tried to pick up a player that a guard let blow by or a guard failed to defend. Most of the moving screen fouls called on Tom have also been more the guard’s fault than Tom’s (guard left too soon or ran too far from the screen).

    Everyone says they want a team that plays tough defense and lately fans have been faulting IU’s defense. Yet, when they decide which players are good, all they look at is how many points he scores. If defense is so important, they why aren’t defensive contributions valued? Tom is not an outstanding all around Big 10 center. But he is a pretty darn good defender. Tom is also the screen setter some of our most dependable scorers come off when they score a basket. IU BB fans are supposed to be above average in understanding basketball. If that’s true then IU fans should start looking a both sides of the ball when they evaluate a player.

    As for who should transfer or who fans won’t miss, I would argue that tossing the names of 19, 20, 21 year old kids around on the Internet like they are a product or commodity is shabby. The players on our team are our players, even the ones we think we don’t like. They are all good students, good citizens and good teammates. We should support our team and set aside speculation regarding specific players, in my opinion.

  21. Here Here Boomer. I agree – let the season play out – let the “young men” continue to try and develop. Let them go to class; continue to practice; and grow as not only basketball players in a tough, tough conference but also as young men that will be somehow contributing to our society in a few years.
    All of this crap from you “so called fans” – is just that – crap. Maybe you should transfer!!

  22. 1981-82 3.0 Avg
    1982-83 1.6 Avg
    1983-84 3.9 Avg
    1984-85 5.2 Avg

    Total Points Scored: 356
    Total Games: 98

    Career Avg. 3.6 ppg

    The stunning production of Dan Dakich during his four years at IU. Between the years of 1976 and 1987, the typical 4-yr. basketball player at IU had approximately a 92.7% chance of one of his years in uniform being on a NCAA championship team…Unfortunately, this would not happen for Dan…He split the uprights perfectly(a banner hoisted the year before he arrived and a banner two years after his departure)..Are we beginning to understand the man a little better? Defense was always his game at IU. Now he’s determined to finally get some offensive production with his mouth…Guess you could say the points not realized in the past have been “transferred” to pointless rumors the present.

  23. Dan does seem to have an ax to grind. Interesting career. Aside from one game it would be easy to forget he ever wore the candy stripes. His importance to Hoosier lore has grown with the passing years, quite a bit due to his own horn tooting. He is a Hoosier legend much the same way as everyone over age 55 seems to have attended Woodstock. People just assume it’s true.
    As far as transfers and fan support, we love our Hoosiers, until we don’t, and then they are bums. Neil Reed was perhaps the most popular player on the team until his incident with Coach Knight (describe it however you wish). When it became clear he would be parting ways with the team most fans (by that time there were plenty who were tired of Coach’s antics) decided he was never any good to begin with.
    I am in the camp that thinks these are kids growing into men and it’s not very likely that they have convoluted schemes up their sleeves. Nor do the coaches. Scholarships are year-to-year and that should not be a surprise to players or fans. Every parent reading this who has a kids on scholarship knows that money can disappear tomorrow if you son/daughter doesn’t meet expectations.

  24. Every parent reading this who has a kids on scholarship knows that money can disappear tomorrow if you son/daughter doesn’t meet expectations.

    Absolutely. Same for everybody else, including coaches. Case in point: Bill Lynch and (soon) Mr. Tom Crean. We’ve paid Crean so far one million per Big Ten win. A bit much, don’t you think? AD Glass will soon realize it’s time for him to hire a basketball coach for this program, and thus correct the last of Greenspan’s big mistakes.

  25. Chet:

    You made far too logical and realistic sense with post #25…you are hereby banned from speaking about the current IU hoops situation.

    Signed,
    Common Sense has no place in discussions about IU Athletics

  26. DM you make some fair and valid points but there is no need to barricade yourself in.Everyone who has an opinion different than yours is not your enemy.

  27. Double that ditto..Great post, Chet. It’s blowing my mind how good Dakich is at the sports desk of ESPN. Not getting the chance to coach the Hoosiers was likely a godsend. He has completely reinvented himself and you have to give him credit for his unbelievable resiliency and drive. I think the Knight banishment may be the source his difficulty in concealing the “ax”.

    I truly like Dan Dakich. There is definitely a part of me that can understand the ax he’s grinding. Is there a point when loyalty and protection of something an obsessive devotion impedes growth and autonomy? Isn’t it a maturing process to back away a bit? Isn’t it time to just let it all go and quit caring so damn much about all the decision processes at Indiana? Nothing good will come of continually measuring every new coach against Bobby Knight. I loved the winning during our hoops heyday. But I don’t decieve myself(as I think you were conveying with your Neil Reed reference) into believing we were always culturally perfect, doing everything “the right way”, until Kelvin Sampson came along.

  28. Patience, is all we have right now folks. We either use it, or we do not. Try to keep things in perspective. This was a weaker team before Guy’s, Creek’s and now Jones setbacks. I did think we would make the NIT. This team has had no luck at all. Learn to watch the small things during games. Think of how sweet it is going to feel in a couple of years when winning happens. What are we gonna do, stop loving IU? Are we gonna be fair weather fans? It’s your choice. It’s your conscience.
    We also need to chill on bashing each other. I also think we, have whipped ourselves into a frenzy. This is all making other teams and their fans happy. Perspective and patience. It will be more fun for all of us.
    You can bash me, but please really think about the simplicity of what I wrote.

Comments are closed.