Discuss: Indiana vs. Michigan (Christian Watford is in uniform)

Christian Watford is in uniform during the team’s initial warmup. No word on how much he will play, or even if he will play, but the fact he is in uniform suggests he is an option.


  1. Anyone wanna say how important rivers is to the team, about 3 turnovers 4 fouls and a techincal plus not playing good defense…nice

  2. Everyone has a bad game. He was mugged under the basket before he was called for his 3rd foul. That pussy Novak gave him an elbow up by the face after the stoppage. The refs missed an obvious foul and then a cheap shot. I’m glad he reacted. It’s just a damn shame the one-sided officials know how important Rivers is in this game for Indiana. Hard to believe a fan of the Hoosiers would rather piss on Rivers’ name and ignore the dirty play of an opposing player. Did you see Novak’s expression as he walked away? Probably the same rat face you had when you placed your infantile comment.

  3. Yea, don’t ya just love someone that picks a bad game by one of the players to post on? It should be commented on that the free throw shooting is horrible. I know we don’t have a lot of options on the interior but how does a college player shoot 29% on the season from the free throw line? 3pt defense has left players wide, wide, wide open.

  4. FINAL: MICH 73, IU 69.
    IU: Watford 14; Oladipo 13; Jones 12; Hulls 10; Roth 6; Pritchard 4, 7reb; Moore 4; Rivers 2; Elston 2; Sheehey 2.
    IU: 26-55 (47%) FG; 4-16 3PT; 13-22 FT; 32 reb; 13 TO; 16 (30) fouls.
    MICH: 23-43 (54%) FG; 8-15 3PT; 19-37 FT; 25 reb; 12 TO; 15 (23) fouls.
    MICH: Hardaway 26; Morris 15; Douglass 13; Novak 10, 7reb; Morgan 6; Smotrycz 3.

  5. What’s the point of trashing Rivers anyway? You already posted once in your broken English, why twice? There’s a reason that nobody is agreeing with you. He plays good defense, and he plays big. We need him. Take a look at the Hoosiers and tell me that we don’t need more height in there. With Hulls and Moore in the game together, we are SHORT.

    Given our talent pool this year, Rivers is absolutely a starter and a key player. I wish he could score more, that would open up the game alot more for everyone, but we have to work with what we have. I’m sure the opposing defense loves it when Rivers, Moore, and Pritchard/Cap are in the game at the same time — they only have two major scoring threats on the floor to guard. Someday soon we will be able to put 5 shooters out there at once…

  6. I wonder what IU does in practice? For sure they don’t practice free throw’s…they don’t practice any defense..so I wonder what it is they do?In a 40 minute game today we played 8 minutes of ok defense..32 minutes of no defense at all.Shot 13-22 from foul line..and lost by 4.Crean reverted back to his old coaching style..played 13 player’s today.You cannot play 13 player’s and expect to win.Daniel Moore played as many minutes as the starter’s.Matt Roth..Bobby C…Derek Elston..all played behind #24…and I don’t even think he was in the program..never heard of him.Those kid’s need to transfer as soon as the season is over..with Zeller and Austin coming next year..and VO and Will being soph. those kid’s will not play much next year..and then the following year..those kid’s with the class that’s coming in that year…the before mentioned won’t ever play.They need to transfer after this season..or there college playing day’s are over.Crean’s coaching today was about has worse as I ever have seen since he came here.I thought he was doing some better..having the kid’s ready to play…not subbing as much..that all went away today.Daniel Moore…are you kidding me???Who in the world is #24???IU didn’t play that well the last 8 minute’s…Michigan played worse…they were trying not to lose instead of playing to win…they are a horrible team…IU beat them by 19 so what does that tell you?? Doesn’t matter who Crean get’s to come here..if you don’t play defense in the B10..you don’t beat anybody.This is the worse defensive team I have ever seen from any team in college basketball..ever.Every game an opposing player has ther career high against IU!!!IU did play better in the previous 4-6 games…but still lost…it’s not about playing better…it’s about winning….remember Crean….THIS IS INDIANA!!!

  7. Way to much 1 on 1 action. And it reflects in the assists department. Indiana is one of the worst teams in the country in that department & worse in the rebounding department.

  8. Crean should have been all over the refs for the technical call on Rivers. I believe there was a ref directly in front of that play & actually should have called an immediate T on the Michigan player.

  9. Does anyone else see that each time down the floor regardless of who’s out front they always have to hand motion for players to move into some position you would think that maybe they should practice where to be in practice . just wondering.

  10. Chet- Terry was right and IU for life (if it weren’t for his bad grammer) seems like he knows alot u just got to give guys chances, rivers has played bad the past couple games so maybe he should get less minutes i don’t know what they should do but like I said Terry nice job and IU for life keep your head up there are some jerks on here.

  11. When Crean starts playing about 7-8 player’s we will start playing well again.As soon as VO made the lane violation he knew he was coming out..freshman can’t play knowing if they make a mistake they are coming out.Crean should start Hull’s..Jone’s..Watford..VO..Will….and bring Pritchard and Elston in off bench.Only play Bobby C when game is out of reach.Daniel Moore is a practice player only…River’s should only play for 3-4 minutes at a time.But it really doesn’t matter who play’s or doesn’t play..until defense is top priority..not scoring..defense..we will only win when we play horrible team’s that we should beat..like…the pre B10.The 3 games we have won in the B10…are against team’s that are struggling worse than us…IU has not beat a quality team this year.The 3 teams we beat in B10..we play them again..we would lose by 10 to each of them.Crean is just like the team…for 3-4 games he does a great job…then coach’s like he has never been a coach before.I mean come on man..what possibly made him put #24 in the game??Any body got an answer for that??What makes him play Daniel Moore over Matt Roth?When the game is on the line in the last minutes…he is lost..runs up and down and look’s more like a fan than the coach.That is where he need’s to take control and draw up a play to win…not jump shots when your only 1 down.Crean is a decent coach..but like Davis…just in over his head at IU.He had 1 season at Marq. and that makes him a quaified coach for IU???He was going to lose his job there…don’t believe me??…read the website from when he left..fans there were glad to see him go.He would tell recruits they would get alot of playing time if they camt to Marq. then when they didn’t..they left..had lot’s of transfer’s in his last 3 year’s.Now I give him credit…he don’t cheat..run’s a clean program…but I can name you alot of coach’s that do also that would and could do alot better at IU than Crean.But that’s a dead issue..Crean is here for many year’s to come..buy out is unreal..millions of dollar’s.Let’s just hope that somehow IU get’s this turned around soon…but I don’t see a 20 win season for at least 3-5 year’s…and by that time it will be to late..IU if we’re not already..will become another DePaul..UCLA..We will suffer for Brand’s and Sampson’s stupidity for many year’s to come.

  12. O K, I somehow made it through your grammar and spelling challenged post. I’ll skip all of the delusional parts except the one where you say you know a lot of coaches that would have took the job, under the same conditions that Crean did, run a clean program where the kids all go to class and don’t barely scrape by and already be winning big too. Please, enlighten us. This is a list I have got to see, go ahead and amaze all of us. Oh yea, if Alford makes your list then after posting maybe you should call 4braincells and tell him to make sure his mom’s basement door is unlocked cause you’ll be there in a little bit.

    P.S. If you were much of an IU fan you would know who # 24 is regardless of how much he plays. Just sayin’.

  13. I don’t know if I’m missing anything here but does there seem to be too much 1 on 1 play? The national ranking on assists certainly says so, besides the rebounding.

  14. I don’t get to watch many games b/c I don’t have BTN, but from what it sounds like, Creen’s coaching style has been different in the games we have won in the Big Ten. Any truth to that? Also, what happened down the stretch in this one to make us play better, albeit too little too late?

  15. Foul shot attempts 37 to 22, and fouls called 23 to 30, a disparity over 20%. I thought the rules of BB called for 5 on 5 play not 8 on 5. I hope that tape gets priority when being scrutinized by the B10. Crisler should not offer that big of an advantage.

  16. Ya there is way to much 1 on 1 and it seems most of that is just VJ3, he seems to slow down our offense

  17. Greatly saddened to hear that Crean could possibly stay much longer. I live just outside Lafayette and loved cheering against the Boilers. I’m tired of looking for excuses for the Indiana program. I’m not a racist, normally, but if you can’t recruit skilled blacks, you need a Coach K or a Roy Williams to be successful in Div I. I think Crean is over his head at IU, just as someone else just said.

  18. Shots from the perimeter weren’t falling, gang. It seemed like everything a Hoosier put up from the outside was an inch long(caroming off the back the iron). The refs did miss some calls but I think the main reason we lost was the slow start and the bad shooting night(entire first half and from the perimeter int the second). I do think Pritchard has been really playing well on defense and the boards. He moved surprisingly well on the traps in the full court press during the final minutes last night. With the exception of Watford, it’s just a shame we can’t get more scoring down low. Three old men in a nursing home probably score more on a Saturday night than Pritch, Elston, and Capo.

    Let’s talk pizza! Best pizza you ever had anywhere on the globe? Best pizza in Bloomington? Is it Nick’s?

    Is there anything approaching a delicious homemade pizza(like the mouth-watering varieties we discussed the other day on the blog) that can be found in B-town? Every trip I make to Bloomington I always end up at Trojan Horse. I love TH but I’d sure like to find a great pizza place when I make the rare trip down.

    Hoosiers put up a hell of an effort to get back in the game against Michigan. A couple shots fall and that was potentially the best comeback in a college game in the past decade. I don’t think we should be so down on them….just my take.

  19. PizzaWhat-

    If you are forced to settle with non-homemade pizza, I personally like Mother Bear’s the most (didn’t you say that you used to work there? Maybe you got sick of their pizza back in the day).

    They give you the option of a super-thin crust or deep-dish, both of which they do well. A simple pepperoni pizza at is what I normally get. I’ve always felt you can judge a pizza place based on its pepperoni or cheese pizzas; fancy toppings are usually a cover-up for a lackluster foundation (see “Aver’s” for an example – a place that uses cheap, low quality “fancy” ingredients to compensate for gross Sysco mozarella and an overly doughy, undercooked crust).

  20. I don’t buy into the fact that the refs played favorite to Michigan. After all, they are employed by the Big Ten/NCAA & do not work only Crisler Arena games. They are scrutinized by their employer just like everyone else & I believe they do the very best they can do as well as we try to do in our jobs. I’m strictly an IU basketball fan & saw bad calls both ways. Albeit the technical call on Rivers was a pretty bad call.

  21. As for the refs..that’s life in the B10..IU get’s it’s fair share of call’s at Assembly Hall and has for many year’s.For Crean…yes he will be at IU for many year’s to come..buy out is a crazy number…he has to pay IU if he wants to leave and IU has to pay him to fire him.Seem’s to me that I am not the only one who think’s IU could have done better than Crean.I know for a fact..that at least 2 board of trustee member’s wanted Alford and a call to his agent was made.Money was the deciding factor for Alford not being offered the job after Davis’s interim year.IU knew it could get Davis cheap and that Alford would cost them..Alford would not discuss term’s until IU pubicly fired Davis..and IU wouldn’t do that.That’s not rumor..that’s fact.Randy Wittman wanted the job bad..he hated the NBA and wanted to get into college bb…Greenspan promised Wittman at least an interview..Greenspan never called him back…that’s not rumor..that’s fact…Keith Smart also was promised at least an interview..Greenspan never called him back…that’s not rumor..that’s fact.I promise that any of the 3 above would be running just as clean as program as Crean..and any of those 3 would be winning more than Crean is now…because…those 3 would teach defense..and if they didn’t play defense better than they are now..they would be gone.None of those 3 would have brought in half the player’s Crean brought.You don’t think those 3 could recruit the state of Indiana better than Crean??Don’t know this for fact…but I was told that Bob Knight called Alford and told him if he came to IU he would sever all ties with him.And guess who got Alford the job at New Mexico…yep..Bob Knight.The president of University of New Mexico has ties with the General from Texas Tech.Knight knew if he could Alford a kob somewhere..anywhere..that he wouldn’t go to IU..and Knight knew the job that Alford would do at IU.Alford would have struggled the first year at IU just like Crean did…but then the level of player’s that he would recruit to IU would not be like we have now.Look at what he has recruited to NM…out in the middle of the desert…not exactly a hot bed of college bb…in the state of Indiana…Alford would have gotten whoever he wanted..unless Coach K wanted them..then no one win’s that battle.Wittman or Smart would have also won here..maybe a little slower than Alford…but by now in there third year…we would be winning 17-20 games a year.Again because of defense.Crean is not a bad coach..neither is 75% of all the other coach’s in college…but put an Indiana boy…or former IU player..somebody with IU ties here…they understand the type of ball we have to play here and the type of player’s we have to have here…a Michigan never has..nor ever will.In Tom Crean’s own word’s…THIS IS INDIANA….the quicker he get’s that..the quicker we win.Get use to it IU fans…our good year now is a 17-13 record and a hope and a prayer of an NCAA berth…NIT is where IU will play now…on a good year.

  22. More rumor, gossip and wishes than can be believed. Alford already displayed his coaching prowess in the B10 and surrendered, just to tough a challenge for his abilities. If KS and RW wanted to be in college coaching so desperately they could easily have a college coaching gig of their choosing. This program that was described as a train wreck is on course and on schedule with bountiful recruiting for as far as a far-sighted person can see. What is lacking is an adequate post player and little luck keeping the injury bug away. No, the future will be many more cheers than boos.

  23. Exactly HC. Terry has got to ask 4cells to move the Bob Knight statue farther away from the furnace and closer to the basement door, the fumes are obviously working on the two of them pretty bad.

    Don’t know if I have ever seen any IU coach recruit the state of IN better than what Crean has been able to line up over the next 3 years. I know I will enjoy the success that will be IU’s starting next year but having idiots like Terry going away and not coming back will probably be number two.

  24. Terry’s no idiot. IU needs one of their own running the program. I know that isn’t always possible, but can you see Kentucky, N Carolina, Kansas, or Duke (to name a few) change head coach and go 3 years with a cellar team?? Absolutely not!!

  25. Bill- There is absolutely no evidence that “one of our own” would lead a more successful program than an”outsider.” Be careful with the “one of our own” train of thought. It is more of a romantic idea than an empirically proven truth.

    It can often turn out to lead to an unhappy marriage, as witnessed most recently with Dave Wannstedt taking over the Pitt football program.

    Like Mike said, Crean has recruited this state so well, that you’d guess he lived here all his life. Recruits really don’t seem to care where the coach was born.

  26. Bill, first off, yes, Terry IS an idiot. I’m beginning to think that 4guards has came back only under a different name because Terry’s train of thought and reasoning resembles 4guards’ thinking and reasoning more than just a little bit. You know the ole, Crean is unable to do anything good enough and never will be able to and only a person anointed by His Holiness BK will be able to succeed at IU. We don’t know what these other schools would do because they or no one else has never had to deal with what Crean has had to deal with, although pUKe’s team may very well be left in something resembling what our’s looked like one day soon. And do we really want to follow examples set by pUKe ?

    You mention Duke, well you might want to take a look at what Coach K’s record was the first two or three years he was there and this was with him taking over in a situation that was a whole lot better than what Crean had to start with. Many of the Duke faithful wanted to fire him after his first or second year but he was given a real chance and I think most Duke fans would agree that, giving Coach K a real chance worked out pretty good for them. Will Crean work out as good for us as Coach K did for Duke, I don’t know but the only way we will know for sure is if he is given the same chance that was afforded to Coach K and the great thing about it is when he does get it turned around it will be accomplished with more or less all Indiana kids. Find something to complain about when it comes to that !!

  27. I don’t know Terry–maybe he is an idiot and maybe Crean is a great coach–whoever is responsible for recruiting needs to go back to bagging groceries. I don’t question Crean’s background or understanding of the game, the real athletes aren’t coming to Bloomington. I’ve always thought the head coach was responsible for a big part of the recruiting. Maybe next year IU will have that great team (I really do hope so), true IU fans deserve it!!

  28. Alford, Smart would have IU winning by now? LOL What track record do they offer? There’s always those delusional few that think should happen overnight under these circumstances. This team looks much better this year than last even tho they still are losing. As one poster put it, I now sit down and watch them thinking there’s that possibility to win. I firmly believe next year will be the over the hump season.

    Crean is no coach K? Neither was coach K a coach K his 1st few years. You think coach k is so GOD like & this super human coach, he still had terrible seasons the 1st few years, so if K can have them, why not another coach?

  29. Not getting the talent? Umm Hulls..Mr. Basketball, Zeller, one of the top recruits in the country? Creek? Surely, your not basing this on facts but on bias perception?

    You might have a slight point. The 1st cpl years, why would anyone want to go Indiana regardless of who the coach is? To get the states best player your 2nd year is quite a feat. IU returned 2 players Crean’s 1st year that avg. together 1.7 minutes of playing time. I feel the program & Crean have established an environment that will help with the recruiting of top notch players & that shows by getting Zeller next year. But, I don’t care how popular a coach is or how good of a recruiter he is, those 1st 2 years the cards are heavily stacked against him, esp with all the restrictions. Are all the restrictions lifted yet that he accepted when arriving?

  30. It is pretty easy to see that there are alot of stupid IU fans out there.But I will not bring myself down to these idiot people’s level..oops think I just did…O well….As far has me not being able to get over the Bob Knight era…not true..Coach Knight did so much for IU but it was time for a change..for him and IU.The only thing that makes it so bad was the way it all happened.I only wish he could have went out a hero instead of the goat..but some of that was Coach Knight’s fault.I believe IU and Brand would have given him a hero’s send off if he would have let them..but he would not do that.Brand was brought into IU for one reason..to get rid of Coach Knight..job done.He sure didn’t stay long afterward’s.My problem with this whole thing is..it’s not really Mike Davis..or Sampson or Crean’s fault..the fault lie’s with the board of trustee’s.They had no idea how big a job they were being ask to do.They were all driven by money..or the lack thereof.IU had one chance to do this right..and they failed terribly..and all IU fan’s will suffer for many many year’s to come.IU had no choice but to hand Davis the interim job…firing Coach Knight 1 month before the season started.The player’s then threatened to walk away if Davis was not given the job…second mistake..never let kid’s make threats..they were not going anywhere.After that first year..they should have opened the hiring process up to any coach in the country..just to see who was interested.At that point IU was still a top notch program any coach would have been proud to coach.Mistake #3…giving the job to Davis who had never coached before..then taking Coach Knight’s team to the final game..mistake #4..giving him a long time contract.Then mistake #5..Herbert said himself…we cannot fire Davis and replace him with a white coach..his exact quote was ‘WE ARE OPENING A CAN OF WORMS THAT WE CAN NEVER SHUT”…mistake #6…Sampson.All of this could have been avoided had IU done it right when they had the chance.IU had to…they had no choice…but to pay Alford any amount of money that it had to to get him here.Alford has done a great job everywhere he has been…even Iowa..until the AD there wanted him to play a kid who had been arrested 3 times…and Alford refused.Had IU hired Alford after Davis interim year…IU still is a national power..we would not know the effect’s that we know now…and Alford would be the IU coach for the next 25 year’s…if IU had struggeled some..the fans would have been alittle bit more patience..because we would have had one of our own…but I doubt that we would have struggeled at all.Herbert..Greenspan..and the board of trustee’s are who to blame for the crumble of a once mighty program..a mighty program even before Coach Knight.For those of you who think Crean is a better coach than Alford..it’s because you have no idea what Indiana basketball is about.Crean is a decent coach..I give him credit for that..but he will never win big at IU..getting big name recruits is great…but you have to know how to coach them once you get them…and he knows nothing about defense.Hoosier Scoop…do a poll with these names..Alford..Crean..Wittman..Smart..to coach IU..and see who wins…I promise Crean will be third or fourth…willing to take that challenge??? I really hope Crean turns IU around..I love IU…and I know he is here for many year’s to come…but with every loss…every terrible season…thank your board of trustee’s.

  31. Bill:Terry’s no idiot. IU needs one of their own running the program. I know that isn’t always possible, but can you see Kentucky, N Carolina, Kansas, or Duke (to name a few) change head coach and go 3 years with a cellar team?? Absolutely not!!

    Their own? The Big Ten proved too much for Alford. Smart? Heck, I don’t know what he’s doing. I’m assuming coaching but have no idea where or how well he’s doing. Not that great if I’ve never heard anything.

    These coaches did not come in under the same circumstances in case you were unaware. Not one of these programs you mentioned were on probation. Not one of them were left with a total of 1.7 minutes of playing time experience from the previous year. Not one of them had scholarship restrictions. Not one of them had recruiting restrictions of which Crean had restrictions of himself personally, no contact with recruits. I commend any player for the forfeit they gave the 1st 2 years at IU. These players would have experienced a far greater success rate elsewhere, at least I don’t think they would have been humiliated as much. For them, it produces a far greater human being but, they had chanced to go elsewhere.

  32. Errick Suhr could have this team in the NCAA tournament THIS year if he took over right now for Crean. Such is the nature of possessing an Indiana birth certificate.

    It does wonders! Some say that if you bring your Indiana birth certificate to any college basketball game, the coaches of whichever teams are playing will call security and have you removed: they fear for their jobs when “Indiana guys” are in attendance!

  33. Jarvis-

    Is Mother Bears still at 3rd and Jordan? I never worked at Mother Bears..I did at one time work as a closing shift manager for a hamburger joint while my wife was finishing her degree. The extremely hard-working crew I would put in my hours with during those last two years of my time in Bloomington taught me far more than I learned in four years of a business school classroom…I remember a 16-year-old girl named Tawny that would have to occasionally take insulin shots on my shift..Severe diabetic..She had a wonderful bright outlook on life and exuded an energy and optimism that I have never seen equaled. I hope she’s doing well. She was always kind to me and she would bring her parents in on the weekends. She was so proud of her job and the people she worked with. When I listen to whiners on this blog it makes me a bit sad they haven’t encountered much of anything simple in life to give true perspective. Maybe it’s like you said, “fancy toppings are usually a cover-up for a lackluster foundation”.

    When Knight was hired was he “one of our own”? Now I think I see where Terry is coming from.

  34. I take back what I said about Terry-if he’s an idiot, so am I. Alford would have been perfect for the job. It’s a shame we can’t get a Patino or a Bo Ryan–they know talent and how to use it..

  35. Branch McCracken..one of our own..Lou Watson..one of our own…Bobby Knight..not one of our own…but here’s the difference.IU was not on sanctions..probation or anything like that…but IU had not won for several year’s.Nobody had ever heard of Bobby Knight…but in his second year he won..third year he won big…and we all know from there..so there was not really anything to complain about.Crean a little different situation..nobody expected IU to win the first year…but I think everybody expected IU to be better than we are in his third year.If you think IU is getting better and we are where we should be and are on track..then your expactations of IU basketball isn’t very good.IU got 6 wins his first year..10 last year and 12 this year with really only a chance for maybe 1 more win this year..so 13 his third year.We have played no body…nobody!!!and should have lost to Ferris State..we are no better this year than last year and only slightly better than his first year.We are playing harder and are staying in some games this year…but still losing..IU should have at least 16 wins right now to be on track with the teams we played pre B10.Crean could coach at a mid major school and do very well..Davis is doing well at UAB…but THIS IS INDIANA…don’t settle for second or third or fourth best…unless you plan on becoming a trustee at IU..that’s all you have to expect from yourself to get that job.

  36. Alford perfect for the job? Yea, his Iowa track record proved it. What national powerhouse did he come from before Iowa? The Big Ten ate him alive.

    It seems many of the fans don’t get just how broken down this program was.

  37. RMK is a Buckeye-was not born nor played as “one of our own”.
    I hope Hugh and Dustin provide the poll requested. Terry will be foolishly embarrassed with the outcome.
    Prominent coaches would have been damn scarce wanting the IU job immediately following a legend.
    As far as members of the 2000 team threatening to leave if MD was not named the coach, I suspect Odle, Moye and Fife would have disappeared before you could blow out a match.
    I proudly sat in the stands in 1987 for the final home game against the Buckeyes and listened to Alford’s Senior talk. Even with that and how he shined for 4 years as a star in an offense RMK designed around him cannot displace the facts of his mediocre coaching performance in the big time at Iowa and his subsequent retreat to the MW conference. Yes Steve Alford is one of our own, but I have never wanted him here as HC.

  38. Steve Alford was a mediocre coach in the Big Ten. End of story. In my opinion, that is not the reason he should never have been considered for head coach. Had he been hired, being the Indiana legend he is, it would have been impossible to fire him. We would have been no better than Iowa but he would be here FOREVER.

  39. Crean could coach at a mid major school and do very well..Davis is doing well at UAB…

    …and Pat Knight is doing just fine at Texas Tech. Isn’t he?

    There’s a ton of pepperoni on Terry’s extra large pizza covering up his flimsy crust that ignores the most obvious of truths. Chet makes a good point on Alford. But wasn’t Pat Knight being groomed by his father to be the next head coach of the Hoosiers when Alford was starting his coaching career? The plan for IU was no different the plan implemented at Texas Tech. Terry can slander Myles Brand in his grave and the trustees all he wants. If Bob Knight was still on good terms with IU that would mean we would currently be experiencing Patrick in about the 10th year of his 35 year stay in Bloomington. Would Alford, Smart, Fife, or any your homegrown boys be willing to wait until they’re in the Polident years to be head coach of the Hoosiers?..And, of course, that’s assuming Pat doesn’t have a son to take over when he’s done with the throne. There was never a chance in hell for anyone other than Pat Knight to be the next Hoosier coach if Bobby doesn’t break his “zero tolerance” rules. Was it Myles sinister plan to take down Bobby so we didn’t have to endure Patrick until 2045? Now there’s a heroic deed if I ever saw one.

  40. I was waiting for someone to post that they “know all” and their word is GOD!!! And it’s the one’s that brag about their smartness or about everyone else’s stupidity really don’t realize just how much of an idiot they look themselves when they post, they don’t fool me at all!

  41. But can they keep it up in the second half? If so, being a spoiler will be all this team has left in the tank. I look to next year as a whole new start, hopefully with the “Knight” era ending at season’s end.

    Good close game but still the same results we are used to seeing in basketball. Time for a new coach.

    and yes, I’m with Raider1992. Still need a coaching change. Sorry, PK

    What a shame this BB season has been! Both Roberson and Singletary could have had great seasons, but they’ve just thrown away their senior years—with PK’s sorry coaching not helping. It’s sad to see talent being wasted, but if players don’t care enough to give their best effort or concentration that’s what happens. Singles’ injury is about as fishy as anything I’ve ever seen, and I’m glad to know this is his last month playing for TTU. Same for PK—that new AD can’t take office and clean house soon enough for me. It’ll be nice to see a decent coach (hopefully) take over our program again! (Maybe BCG?)

    Wow..Those were just a few comments plucked off a popular Red Raider’s basketball blog..This could have been the fate of Indiana hoops for a very long time. Surely three championship banners could give a legendary coach’s son far more job security than allowed by the impatient fans of Texas Tech..And to think we screwed it all up somehow..How could we let this future slip away?

  42. ^Good research.

    I love when Pat Knight’s name comes up, because their isn’t a better foil to the arguments of the anti-Crean zealots (all 5 of them). There also isn’t a better example of why the grass isn’t always greener.

    The crybabies who wanted Crean fired for not taking his 6-25 Hoosier team to the tournament in his first year pointed to what Alford and Knight were doing at their respective programs. These guys had taken over relatively stable programs laden with upper-classmen, and were able to enjoy success while Crean rebuilt. Now, while Alford has continued to have success in his weaker conference, Patty now has a worse record than Crean, despite having more talent and experience.

    Patience is a dead virtue in this country these days; people would rather have the instant high of some quick wins at the expense of long-term health. Luckily, the powers that be understand that long-term health requires patience.

  43. I never wanted Pat Knight to coach IU.Like I said..IU and RMK both needed a change..not upset that he left..upset with how it went down…most of that RMK’S fault.But that’s when the problem happened.That’s were IU messed up…not with the firing of RMK ..but how the direction of the future went.Alford is no world class coach..I agree…but would have done a great job at IU had he taken over the program after MD interim year.If IU fans don’t agree with that…then just look at the last 10 years and tell me how it could have been better…who would have been a better fit at IU after RMK than Alford??? Really I would like to know.

  44. Brad Brownell, Jamie Dixon, Tom Crean, and Randy Wittman were all names being tossed around at the time with equal weight.

    After Alford’s nasty divorce with Iowa, I believe that IU did the right thing. They realized the risk was high with Alford. While he would provide some quick touchy-feely moments for the Knight loyalists, the consequences of not producing victories quick enough could be catastrophic for Alford’s legacy at IU.

    Not hiring Alford was in the best interest of both parties. Reason prevailed over sentiment, unlike in the Bill Lynch hire.

    Alford looks good now only in a “hindsight is 20/20” kind of way. By the way, he is 5-5 in the Mountain West Conference at present.

  45. Smerdyakov all along-

    I like your way of thinking. That’s exactly why I placed those comments on the blog. I don’t follow the Red Raiders and I don’t know the ups and downs Pat Knight has probably faced when competing for recruits against some very strong programs in the Big 12. It has to be tough to try and continually see your progress defined in relation to one of the best to coach the game. It can’t be any easier when that man just happens to be your father. Pat Knight may be a much better coach than indicated by where his team falls in the standings. And let’s face up to some facts…Let’s give our passion for hoops in this state and our high school coaches some credit for the successes our college coaches. Indiana turns out some damn good basketball players..But wasn’t having access to the talent pool available in your backyard far different 20 years ago than today? I don’t think there were the lures and enticements that find many of these top prospects packing their suitcases. Look at the drama surrounding the recruitment of Zeller..9 out of 10 times in the past decade we’ve lost those battles. I’m not sure if Crean deserves all the credit..Maybe Cody is just a different kid with a set of priorities uncommon to most. Maybe he does have some pride invested in his state. Maybe he understands the “grass isn’t always greener” as you say. Recruiting has become big business…A kid can market himself so much better with everything available at the fingertips of a cyberspace world..NBA agents get into the picture and corrupt the system…There are countless websites that never before existed…These websites do nothing but continually glorify and magnify kids into instant celebrity where dollars follow there names before they’ve ever opened their first checking account or earned a single penny on a hot summer day cutting a neighbor’s lawn. I was watching Winter Park vs. St. Patrick the other night on ESPN 2..I started to wonder if that team could beat some of the lower teams in the Big 10. I started to realize how Michael Gilchrist and Austin Rivers are already guaranteed millionaires if they can stay away from serious injury for one more year. I’m beginning to wonder if the whole college game is screwed. I’m not sure patience works anymore. Things have changed. Doing things the right way….putting the education of a kid on even ground with his athletic pursuits…Is it even possible anymore? The scales have tipped. It’s far more about the talent today. It’s far more about prep schools becoming NBA training camps where kids put on a show for the college coaches that will get one fabulous year to experience their jaw-dropping gifts we all witnessed beforehand on YouTube clips. I always hear IU fans so desperately clinging to the phrase “we’re doing things the right way”…The NCAA Championships and Final Four banners in Assembly Hall were accomplished by a coach that did it “the right way”. Does most the talent pool from a Top-100 list on Rivals.com give a damn about anyone doing things the “right way”? Do most these kids have any loyalty to anything? The elite status a program once enjoyed means nothing to these recruits. If your program isn’t where they can put their name in big lights for one season then most look the other way. Rebuilding a basketball program? How many John Walls, Kyrie Irvings, or Michael Gilchrists care about patience and rebuilding? It’s building they care about…Building a fortune with no foundation. Building a mansion. Ordering a Papa John’s pizza and having it delivered to their palace by that $6.00 an hour zit-faced teenager they can laugh at for being such a damn loser. Give him a ten dollar tip and show him what heroes are made of. The disciples of coaches that did things “the right way”? They are doomed. Terry is a dreamer..bless his soul.

  46. oops..

    These websites do nothing but continually glorify and magnify kids into instant celebrity where dollars follow [their] names…

  47. Brad Brownell, talk bout a coaching talent underexposed. Somehow his teams do well on the road. He was my choice instead of K. Sanctions. I never have understood how he never has gotten a top 25 job. Maybe he makes Clemson a BB destination in the tough ACC.

  48. Cupcake-

    I agree, the scene has changed completely. In my opinion, college basketball is just another area that uninhibited capitalism has destroyed, perhaps forever. I am thankful that at least the football and hockey people have put certain anti-market devices in place (salary caps, 2-year requirement for NCAA football players) that keep things slightly more competitive and attempt to preserve some of the natural joy of sports.

    The “its just business” attitude is a misguided cliché at best when it comes to sports. Sports is more than just a business. For us and for many people throughout the world, our teams represent our regional and cultural identities and bring joy to our sometimes mundane everyday lives. What happens to them is often seen as a celebration (or affront) to who we are.

    When our heroes and livelihoods become just another victim of the omnipotent power of the marketplace, it is very disheartening.

    However, let me offer a ray of light in response to one of your observations:

    “Do most these kids have any loyalty to anything?”

    The other day on Sportscenter, I was watching the highlights of the Big 12 matchup between Texas and Oklahoma. Kevin Durant, a posterchild one-and-done and a current NBA superstar, was sitting right there on the bench with his Longhorns cheering them on. Sportscenter mentioned some of the excited tweets that he posted before the game. He was a proud Longhorn who seems to be forever-loyal and connected to his school.

    I have seen similar displays of loyalty from NBA millionaires, such as last year when Jon Brockman, Brandon Roy and Nate Robinson, in the midst of their NBA season, chartered a private jet for the three of them to see the Washington basketball team play a tournament game against West Virginia.

    These are just a few scenes that give me faint hope that something besides the almighty dollar motivates peoples’ actions in the sportsworld and beyond.

  49. Smerdyakov-

    I’d love to agree with your “ray of light” perspective but I often wonder if it’s just a desire to flaunt their success and be in front of the CBS/ESPN cameras that draws some of these guys back to their one-and-done roots to take in a game. I saw John Wall doing the same at a recent Kentucky game. I felt more sorry for him than anything else. Can there really be any attachment to the place when you only attended for one year? I kind of felt that he has nothing better to do with his time. There are only a handful of NBA stars that hoard the spotlight of the pro game(Koby, LeBron, and Carmello dominate the conversation on most sports channels…I guess Blake Griffin could be added as the most recent obsession). Many guys that were used to being treated like royalty in high school and college become lost in the background the elite of the elite. When they get to the NBA(with all the maturity a well-rounded adult still not old enough to have a Budweiser in a bar), the hype that followed their every step since grade school has disappeared. All the money one could ever need but the attention fading quickly. Can those gluttonous executives with their trophy wives cheering from the court level seats compare to strolling as the “big man” on campus from Woodburn to Ballentine? Showing up at the old one-and-done stomping grounds makes their empty lives seem whole again.

    A gold-plated box for your placement in the ground will never replace the feeling you sold yourself out to people that used you for pure entertainment value and never saw you as an equal in any other facet your life. I know it sounds harsh and I know it’s unfair to make such broad judgements, but I think they look like wondering zombies when they go back to a place where the primary purpose should have been an education. They cheated themselves and now they go back in fear the foreseen future loneliness that only materialistic goals guarantee instead of the true loyalty and pride in accomplishment for something fondly and genuinely attached.

  50. The picture of college and professional athletics we grew up with has sadly died. All three of my kids are/were D-1 athletes. To my great relief (but increased financial burden) none of them were in ‘revenue sports’. They compete for the competition and varying amounts of highly rationed scholarship money. They will never get a pro contract for their efforts. I have gotten a pretty good glimpse of the lives of both sides of the fence. Their lives are closely intertwined with the revenue sports kids both in training and socially. One of my kids went to a ‘football school’ and the football players were a whole different animal than the rest of the student body. They kids knew it, too. I didn’t get a very good feeling from it. I have another at an Ivy League school (no athletic scholarships for anyone) and the football and basketball players acted no different than the track or wrestling athletes. They won’t get a pro contract but they’ll be OK. ‘High profile’ kids become channeled away from their peers when their talent is identified and they often loose a big portion of their lives. Once a kid has become ‘high profile’ in basketball or football their chances of a normal life become pretty slim.
    When you see the actuaries for professional athletes you have to wonder if they are blessed or cursed. Seventy five percent of them are broke or bankrupt 5 years after their careers end. I believe the life expectancy for ex-NFL players is 50-something. Maybe 60. So, at 30 you’re likely to be penniless, unskilled (should have finished that degree, huh?), in poor health (maybe depression from those concussions), and you probably have no grasp of how the world really works. For every ex-player working for ESPN the are probably 5 in rehab.
    Just going by the numbers, if you want a life that’s in shambles at 30, being a professional athletes is a pretty good bet.

  51. ESPN is the worst thing that has happened to college basketball.In the year’s past..only a hand full of team’s gaot to play on national tv…now every team does.A coach cannot get onto a kid anymore or bench them or try to teach them a lesson anymore…they will just transfer.That’s what happen to Knight…the shot clock..three pointer..and kid’s who say..you can’t treat me like that…i will leave.The Fab Five and there baggy shorts..Allen Iverson..worst thing’s that ever happened to sport’s.Kid’s are more worried about there tatoo’s than there team.Kid’s will sale there conference championship ring’s to get tatoo’s.The NBA and agent’s have ruined the sport.Can’t blamr a kid for leaving after one year to become an instant millionare…can earn more money in 5 years than they can in 20 years getting there degree.You get a four year scholarship..stay four year’s or don’t come at all.No kid should be able to leave for the NBA until after four year’s of college.Then when we see teams with 4-5 seniors on it..then you see good basketball.You hardly ever see any team with more that 1-2 seniors anymore.I hope the NFL…NBA..go on strike and never come back…they are the worst thing that has happened to alot of good kid’s.

  52. There’s more ways to disciplining behavior that beating the shit out of em. Explain your “can’t bench them anymore”? Happens all the time. Can you provide facts on just how many really do transfer b/c of benching procedures? It’s certainly not of epidemic proportions. And just how many more really transfer today vs 20 years ago? I’m sure there’s more but not a catastrophic amount.

  53. I think we all agree on one thing–IU
    needs to return to the national spotlight ASAP. The glory days of the 70’s and 80’s are quickly becoming distant memories. I’ve never been a blogger, but I have to say I’m impressed with the knowledge you guys display. The best 4 years of my life were spent in Bloomington–I’d just like to see someone accomplish what Knight did–Winning was everything, and he was damn entertaining!!!

  54. Wow!!!! Just got back to reading the letters on the blog….They reminds me of the great book of essays by the equally desperate sports journalist of his day Paul Gallico in “Farewell to Sports”.

    What an extraordinarily intelligent, enjoyable and exciting dialogue about the state of sports- in particular the state of sports at IU-, between ‘Smerdyakov’, ‘It was Smerdyakov All Along’ (if in fact these two are distinct from each other), Hoosier Clarion, Cupcake Hogwash, Terry and Chet from (approx.) #50 on. Really, really good and hit both the love and the tragedy of sports we share today. My congratulations and gratitude for a remarkable string of thoughtful sports commentary.

    It is a different world, especially looking at basketball then and now.

    I remember watching RMK run his practices, coach his game and deal with his passion for the pure ‘perfection’ of college basketball when the NCAA ‘caved in’ to the NBA and went to the shot clock. He predicted then, the game would collapse on itself. Sadly, he was right; the moment became the ‘tipping point’ of what used to be a game of skill and intelligence and the beginning of its ‘collapse’ into the chaotically senseless jumping-jack contest of today.

    Worse, it changed the players, it changed the coaches and it changed, over time, the values of sports culture itself. The result? ESPN and all that followed, including the sad scenes and characters described in some of these letters became the bi-product of the ‘show’.

    There’s still a glimmer of hope in fans such as those of you…wish we could all get together at Nicks and drink one last keg to Sports. Thank you.

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