1. Sheehey was literally chanting “Sheehey Sucks” along with the crowd as he shot his 2nd free throw towards the end of the game. It was hilarious. You can actually hear him on the broadcast, but the TV guys didn’t pick up on it. You know he absolutely loves hearing that chant. Apparently enough to join in on it himself. He did miss that free throw however.

  2. Cody Zeller is the preseason Player of the Year? That’s rich. Zeller isn’t even the best player on the IU team. Victor Oladipo is. Zeller needs to be benched until he can play with the heart & intensity of Oladipo. Zeller has been on some kind of emotionless cruise-control more often than not this season. I thought I was watching the reincarnation of Tom Pritchard play last night, and we all know that isn’t a good thing, is it Martha? If Zeller continues on this trend, both Michigan and Illinois are going to abuse my Hoosiers this season, and IU can anticipate 2-3 other assorted B1G losses as well. I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again in closing: Tom Crean is a great recruiter but he is a horrible coach and tactician. As this season progresses you’ll see what I mean.

  3. You mean like the lack of improvement coaching created over the last 4 seasons, 6-10-12-27 W’s, right?

  4. Calm down about the Zeller bashing. Have we gotten so spoiled so quickly that we forgot where we were two years ago? How many players average16 PTs and 8 RBs a game on a balanced team that’s at least as deep as any in the country? Not trying to say he deserves POY right now, but I’d say posting 19 and 10 against a quality opponent on the road is at least deserving of a “good game.”

  5. Yeah… Far too much hyperbole. Zeller wasn’t great last night, but I don’t remember Pritch EVER getting 19 & 10… And if he did we’d have been on here saying how amazing he was and how if it wasn’t for Pritch we would have lost by 20.

    Everyone can relax now on the Zeller for the Wooden Award talk… We know he isn’t quite at that level, but he is an all-American and he is a 1st team all-B1G player.

    Sitting him (for who?) for any extended period only would’ve assured a loss last night.

    By the way Nick, there are more than a few of us on here that have been saying (for weeks now) Dipo is the most impactful player on the team. So you are now part of the club, but you ain’t the President of it. I assume our club will be growing after the Dakich love-fest…

  6. Yea, I’m thinking maybe some players are more focused on their “3” gang signs & chanting, showboating or whatever….hint, missing the free throw. Anyone showboating in my opinion is clearly not focused on the game but more on makin sure they are presenting an arrogant persona to to whoever really cares.

  7. Being cliquey can certainly add to the keenness of one’s basketball opinions on a blog. Nice strategy if you’re talking to tree bark or lobsters.

  8. Punjab= best new addition to the Scoop of late. Keep the comments coming man.

    Harvard= the “Phantom of the Opera” was hilarious. I was impressed with how you got the mask to overlap the face so cleanly – were you using the “Juxtaposer” app? The caption could have been better though. Knowing your distaste for Crean, I’m surprised you didn’t use “Think of me, think of me fondly, when we’ve said goodbye…”

  9. i have been a hoosier fan for 30 years….we all need to appreciate the depth this team has…..when a starter like hulls has a game like he had yesterday, someone from the bench steps up…we have never had a bench with the quality of players such as sheehey, remy, jeremy, elston creek(when healthy) and hanner….even the national championship benches have never been this deep…yes yesterday was ugly, but a won on the road in the big 10 is always a good win…..enjoy the season, you never know when a team like this will re-appear

  10. IU big man 6’8″ and over are going to have to be physically and mentally tougher and play with an elevated level of concentration….Butler was no fluke….Butler did these things to beat IU. IU big men are playing immature.

  11. Focused? I know Will gives the “three to the temple” sign (“gang sign”, that’s rich) but, if there’s a player more focused on the floor I haven’t seen him all year on any team.

    Jake, that WAS hilarious. I don’t remember IU having a sixth man who makes the kind of impact on a game that Will does since Laz and he didn’t bring that kind of energy.

  12. Today’s bowl game really does a great job of showing how far away IU football is away from being competitve against good teams….which I am sure is a well known fact.

  13. Chet,
    Talk about focused, whenever Sheehey enters a game I think immediately of Havlicek, the best 6th man ever.

  14. Will Sheehey is one of the greatest human beings on the planet. Only God can judge William Sheehey.

  15. This board is full of a bunch joke posters who couldnt lead anyone out of a paper sack. The story of last nights game was Ferrell. With Zeller, the point is who can stop him? No one. Is 19 & 10 stopping him? We forget he has no other big men down low to bang around and often times I see 2 bodies on him during rebounds. And when we arent hitting there are lots of rebound opportunities. Even the Butler game, it was hack a Zeller. And, Smith fouled out. If only Zeller hits his free throws that game ends differently regulation.

  16. “Will Sheehey is one of the greatest human beings on the planet. Only God can judge William Sheehey.”

    I don’t know the guy. Maybe he is. Not for me to judge. I sure do like having him on our basketball team, though. The kid is tough as nails on the court.

  17. Are Jeremy and Dustin still nursing hang-overs?

    Got these 2 things from Inside the Hall:

    1) Cody drops to # 9 in the Player of the Year race and may drop off the list entirely.



    And, again, spare me the “You had too high of expectations” because I’m not the one that was screaming “He’s the best player in college basketball” like 99% of the “real” fans were doing.

    2) Pomeroy has IU as an EASY winner of the Big Ten:


  18. Off topic: Sat amongst the entire Penn basketball team at Cheesecake Factory last night…Seemed like a nice bunch from the Ivy League. They must have just arrived in Indy for their @ Butler game tonight. The head coach sure appeared to be a lot of fun.

    I know…it’s not a big deal like having Tom Crean stopping to pull you out of a roadside ditch.

    We take all this stuff far too seriously…Youth is so fleeting..Watching those Penn players in their carefree moments of being young sure made me reminisce of dreams I had as a youngster to one day be something of similar walk.

    My only advice to Cody would be to just enjoy the moment and play with passion. Cherish the short time of limelight and stage. There will always be critics. It’s all gone so quickly and the bonds you’ve formed with your coaches and teammates grown into lifelong friendships is all that really matters in the end.

    Sitting amongst the excited faces of the traveling Penn team made me think how lucky they all really are to find dreams of early childhood becoming realities.

  19. “We”?

    I’m not the one that goes BERSERK and acts like someone punched my grandma in the face when a player gets criticized.

  20. ^Great blogging handle(except for the initials being ‘BS’).

    Fabulous Idea: Why not invite Geoff to be part of the postgame ScoopTalk festivities at Penn State…? He’s been a great b-ball contributor on Hoosier Scoop..Give the guy a shot..Maybe he’ll steal your job in a couple years. I have a gut feeling Geoff would be a natural.

    Hope I didn’t spoil an already planned surprise…Didn’t you once have Chronic appear on a ScoopTalk? Is my recollection accurate that he appeared while not actually “quote unquote” appearing?…Sat outside of the camera view while giving his contributions to the analysis?

  21. Damn my memory.

    It’s a horrible curse to have a mind mixed up with too many recollections fighting about. I once heard of a story about a Russian dude that performed as a magician..He could pull hundreds of trivial facts from various audience members and recite them back in detail upon later command. After years of performing, it all began to muddy up his brain as he became paralyzed by the gift…Every time he heard a word associated to the facts he could never forget, a whole series of memories would fire and connect. He couldn’t walk down the street without the constant diversion of faces familiar and triggering words pulling out every file his mind.

    It’s far more beautiful to romanticize and connect with imagination the fuzzy past than to actually recollect every boring detail.

  22. Harvard,
    You do remember the Chronic appearance and That’s actually a very good idea that I hadn’t previously thought of. I could use a contributor for this one because Jeremy won’t be making the trip. Of course, it would require Geoff to successfully loiter without being tossed at the Bryce Jordan Center for 90 minutes-2 hours because I shoot the video after I write my deadline game story and accounting for the post-game press conference, that’s usually how long it takes for me to finish up. And it would require Geoff to actually want to hang around that long and not begin a search for watering holes. But Geoff, if you’re still in the arena at 11, you’re welcome to be on.

  23. ….’bout time I’m good for something.

    Maybe do the ScoopTalk from a corner booth in a popular Happy Valley watering hole? Some place with a bit of a Nick’s atmosphere going on?

  24. It is an interesting idea, but may not be entirely up to me. Actually the loitering thing wouldn’t be a big deal because I’ll be there with one of the women’s soccer coaches… (cool side note, their team will be honored at halftime for being National Runner-up, so I get to cheer for my buddy in front of their biggest crowd of the year)

    The bigger issue is that I’ll also be there with a group of people including my father, and depending on return travel plans I may have to jet shortly after the game.

    … We’ll see.

    (If the camera adds 15 pounds I may break a few of your screens!)

  25. 1…Cody POY. I’m sure Cody did not campaign for the recognition. Pretty sure he does not care where his “ranking” is at any given moment. From everything I’ve seen and heard his main concern is the “team”.

    My guess. Cody has no chance to be POY. He is surrounded by so much talent and firepower. CWat, Jordy, Vic and Will
    will be makinbg plays and getting points. If suddenly Cody is getting POY attention than I would think other team members are slacking off.? It’s hard to complain about his Iowa numbers.

    In IU’s case I would think the #1 helped in recruitment.

    2…Cody needing to be more agressive complaint. I do see periods of the game where he does not touch the ball. But, per the “Hoops Math” website, Cody has had 126 field goal shots this season. I would venture a guess that for every touch of the ball he will pass it 2 out of 3 times?
    CWat has 120 shots, Will 116, Vic 109, Jordy 106 and Yogi 80. The contribution of these guys is too important for the team and I have no question that Cody recognizes that.
    Only so many shots available per game.

    Again Hoop Math numbers, IU is ranked #20th in “Field Goal % at Rim”. Tied with Iowa. Minnesota #6.

    3…I would like to see a couple of new rules for IU. (Such as Knight’s pass 4 times before shooting) First would be not to shoot the first time you touch the ball when coming into the game. Get into the game flow first.
    Second is for Coach Crean. Please stop pulling the guys out of the game when they hit a couple of shots. So far it is not as bad as last year. Hit a 3 and go sit.

    Bottom line (as someone else pointed out) this is one hell of a team with depth maybe not seen before.

    4..Geoff – Do it.

  26. How coherent do I have to be…

    Does Dustin allow drinking and ScoopTalking? (we all know what happens when I drink and blog…)

  27. Calls for a designated Blogger?

    Back to the IOWA game. The Vic rebound of Cody’s shot near the end of the game, where Iowa had Vic in a body lock. Think that player’s name was White. He is quoted as saying he probably should have fouled Vic. By that point I would think it would be called “Assault”??

  28. Ron–

    As far as Cody’s aggressiveness, it goes way beyond how many shots he takes.

    In the Butler game, he had zero fouls in a very physical game.

    He also did not demand the ball after THREE of their big guys fouled out.

    And he only had 5 rebounds. Half of the other team either matched that or far surpassed that (hopefully that will keep podunker from crying again).

    And against our last cupcake, he wasn’t dominate either.

  29. I would one day like a ScoopTalk from Vegas with guest appearances by Laffy, the Alford bobblehead, Jeff Newton, Wayne Newton, K.D. Lang, and a team of showgirls all named Ginger Knight that cuss up a storm.

  30. Laffy,

    19 and 10 @ Iowa is pathetic too, right? All it took was one loss for you to go from a decent poster to Chicken Little. You must be the only person to think IU was going undefeated.

  31. I know I’m putting a target on myself but I agree with Laffy almost all of the time. Zeller has to be more aggressive and Hulls will/has struggled defensively with ‘top notch’ (meaning quick and athletic) guards on the defensive end of the floor. The ‘best’ thing that ever happened to him is having Yogi come to IU. He can now do what he does best. I wouldn’t want any other center in the country aside from Zeller. However, he has to impose his ‘will’ others which he can. That’s why I’m confused as to why he doesn’t.

  32. Psych – Laffy’s whole point is that he didn’t think IU was going undefeated and he’s banging on people whose expectations were too high…

    While there is some definite attitude and hyperbole you have to wade through, his basic premises are pretty accurate.

  33. Exactly, Geoff.

    And for the 23rd time, I really don’t give a crap about “wins.” Sure, I want to win every game, but I look at “are they playing their best and to their potential.”

    They’re far from it.

    I think I told you I used to have a picture of Knight above my desk with the quote, “You’re real competition is yourself”….or something like that.

    So, I’m hard on the team because they could be so much better and it’s like they have their heads up their butts or something.

    Cody needs to be more mentally tough.

    The thing I LOVED about the Hoosiers years ago is they had that LOOK in their eyes.

    “We’re coming after you.”

    The only person I see that with it Victor.

    Calbert is my favorite player of all time because he was a LEADER. He had a WILL to WIN and everyone else followed him.

    I wish we had someone like that on our team.

    Cody isn’t close to it. And don’t tell me “he’s only a sophomore” either.

    And Jordy doesn’t have it either. Just a LOOK in his eyes of CONFIDENCE…..of a “killer” like Calbert and others had.

    There’s no way we should be starting virtually every game slow…..especially with all the cupcakes we played.

    They should come out from the start with, “We’re gonna step on your throats and not take our shoes off it until the game is over.”

    Butler sure did that so don’t tell me “young season.”

    Until I see, “we’re gonna kick your a$$” in their eyes, like our teams used to have, I won’t be content.

    Has ZERO to do with wins and losses.


    If they had “that look” yet lost every game, I’d be their biggest cheerleader in the world.

  34. I should say Victor has that FIRE.

    And it’s why I think Patterson was a HUGE loss. He played defense like Victor does……like someone slapped his momma.

    That, more than anything, is what we’re missing.

    I think Hanner is getting there…..the “I DARE you to try to score on me” look.

  35. Punjab: is the pun intended? Bill Braski sucks.

    Here are six phases of brainwash courtesy CTC’s apologists:

    1. Before the season most everybody (including Coach Crean’s distinguished colleagues) considers Cody Zeller as potential POY. Everybody is right, of course, Coach Crean is a great recruiter, possibly the best ever!

    2. Cody struggles, falls in the polls. Cody sucks. Crean can only do that much, man, he’s only a coach. He can’t play. (No, really, he literally can’t.) Players play, dude! If Cody is soft it’s Cody’s fault. Crean remains a very great recruiter, possibly a great coach (just you wait until next year!) and let’s now talk Oladipo. Crean is a great developer and a great recruiter. He recruited Dipo and then he developed him. In His Image.

    3. Also Sheehey, Sheehey too—especially when Dipo has an off day. And that’s nothing, just you wait until he’s done with Jonny Marlin.

    4. IU loses to Butler. Coach is smart. Relieves pressure. Cody still soft, why wasn’t he on the floor, why didn’t he grab Crean by the throat and whisper in his face: “Listen carefully Kielbasa: I want in!” before that last minute stunt by Barlow. Why? Because he’s soft, that’s why. (Crean still great.)

    5. Coach retweets thoughtful biblical quotes, helps stranded motorists, almost tackles Bob Knight in NY in an failed attempt to deliver a hug from Fred Glass and all the while keeps recruiting. Hey, this man is on a roll, or rather, on a foot-long: “Italian herbs and cheese”! They aired his Subway commercial in KY, OH, MI, IL, WI, MN and Croatia. No luck yet. Their loss—he’s absolutely charming. Hang on, just got a tweet from Coach:

    “Who is this Rorschach guy and how did he get a hold of so many of our plays?!”

    Beats me, Coach, but Joyce says that God wants us to put Him first in our lives. He wants us to put our confidence and trust in Him, all the time, in everything. So, forget Rorschach. Think God.

    6. This program was so devastated by Sampson, and look where Coach Crean brought it in just five short years: preseason #1, eight at the top, now steady #5 and Cody the preseason POY! Which brings me to recruiting Cody: Crean is possibly the best recruiter evaaaah…!

  36. ^Shut up, Downing. Your live revolves so tightly around stupid posts about coaching merits, I feel sorry for you. Please, for your own good, go give a donkey a hand job – at least then, some one will listen and appreciate you.

  37. It’s fine to be hard on the team..but, really, seriously?

    With all the disruptions…the suspensions of Perea and Jurkin…the injury to Elston..the thee games Hollowell was forced to sit…the two week illness to Cody.

    Is it really fair to be overly critical before some of these disruptions get to smooth themselves out, guys get some more playing time under their belts, chemistry is given an opportunity to gel, and we’re at least 1/3 into the Big 10 season, before we push them all out to the end of the plank for not living up to the concocted hype of prognosticators and fortunetellers of sport that don’t follow the details close enough to understand why the team looks disjointed and out of sync?

    We’ll live up to the expectations…Give it six weeks. Give it a stretch run…Give it an NCAA tournament when we see the team Crean envisioned and recruited galloping at full stride in a style of play very conducive to a deep tournament run.

    When you go trick-or-treating, you don’t give up on the entire potential the full bag of goods in the pillowcase by the end of the night simply because the first few houses had their lights off. We were tricked a little early(NCAA attempted to drop another tainted apple in our bag)…Come end of the route, we may holding the biggest stash.

  38. I agree with you, Laffy… Patterson was a big loss…not only because he played “like someone slapped his momma” defensively, but I have a feeling he was going to quickly grow into a much better offensive player(at a much faster rate than A-Hope projects) than most of us believed he would bring to the table.

    And I still believe not doing everything possible to give Roth his final year of eligibility was careless in terms of an insurance policy for our perimeter game.

  39. I don’t know..Could be a lot of personal bias there. Brennan grew out of the IDS system. He covered IU Basketball for the IDS blog some years ago. He likely blogs at this site and during live game chats under some alias. I think I would actually prefer a true Establishment perspective from someone less personally involved and unattached to journalists that still work the rounds in Bloomington. I don’t care too much about a piece from someone relatively low on the ESPN notoriety totem pole(likely linked here because someone that knows him is trying to up his readership) that likely still spends a share of his time on Hoosier blogging sites.

    The stats do support Oladipo as the main man of late, and at this juncture he’s truly the shining star, but I’m pretty much in the court that this team will flourish only to the extent Cody flourishes.

    You don’t win championships without a dynamic point guard and a confident and dominant big man in the middle…We need to keep the center stage light on Cody. His commitment to Indiana while turning his back on thieves from NC secured our opportunity to leave our darkest hour. Without his commitment, Oladipo rarely be noticed amidst the turmoil and angered fans a team stuck in perpetual stagnation. Our Hoosier would not be a top 25 team…They would be bottom-dwellers, loses on the road would remain commonplace, and he would be the mega star of a last place irrelevant team.

  40. If Jordy can be shut down, you really think Roth would do any better……on both sides of the floor?

  41. Two perimeter threats better than one(especially if one has a cold shooting night). Remember @ Penn State last season? Roth had unbelievably deep range(deeper than Hulls). He could shoot over Twilight Zones…and his higher release on his shot was complimented by a taller frame than our Hobbit shooting guard. Maybe Remy can regain his outside stroke..? I think Remy’s confidence in his shot is drifting fast. VO brings everything but an outside shot.

    Remember the Hoosier team that beat Duke in the Sweet 16(2003?) and Kent State in the Elite 8? Man, oh, man…we had some perimeter weapons on that squad. Against Duke we used heart and more inside game ..Against Kent State we put on a show from beyond the arc.

    The biggest Achilles’ heel of this team is going against a sizable and extremely athletic backcourt shutting down our perimeter game. Thank the Lord for Yogi’s craftiness and speed or Hulls and Watford would get zero looks and we’d be screwed.

    You would be happy, though..They would roll the bowling ball into the painted alley at Cody on nearly every possession. …Bowling for Cody would be our only game.

    Just coined another one…”A range so deep he could shoot over Twilight Zones..”

    I sense Geoff coming at me soon…There are many holes in this one.

  42. And then there is defense.

    Who is Matt going to guard while he’s “raining down 3’s”?

    Roth and Yogi on the court at the same time?

    Ummmmmmmmmmmmm, no.

  43. Butler beat us more as a result their perimeter threat. We couldn’t pack it in..They’re too dangerous from the outside. It’s exactly why Butler could surprise again in the tournament. Clarke nearly has the range of Roth(but with a ton of added versatility and quickness).

  44. Sub him in and out..Use him in particular stretches…Much like Crean manipulates the roster now.

    I don’t remember Roth as being a horrible defender. Once he got through all those foot issues, he became far more active and was a decent help defender. Not a replacement for Hulls…just a damn good insurance policy. And if they both get hot, you can pile up points in a hurry while using them interchangeably as well as complimentary some less than critical strethes.

  45. Sorry, but you’ll never convince me we could have won more with Roth on the court at the same time as Yogi.

    Teams already salivate over the thought of Jordy on teh court with him.

  46. No question..I would never pull Hulls from the lineup in favor of Roth..

    But here’s the bottom line: Roth’s more valuable than Creek, Jurkin, and Etherington. Bless Austin’s heart for all the work bringing Cody & Co. to Bloomington, but even before his injury, we all knew the near zilch value added in depth. Does Jurkin help us bring home a banner this year? Tough decisions for a coach. I wouldn’t want to make them in the midst of too many offers and pending scholarship crunches, but Roth was a player that could have added definite and immediate scoring potential.

    Not to mention…I think his businesslike attitude was good for the team. You’ll never see Roth get cocky and place three fingers to his temple for something he can deliver from 28 feet in the pressure-packed moments of a Big 10 war on the road with higher percentage and greater ease than most on the roster can deliver from the charity stripe during pregame warm-ups. There’s a psychological effect on your opponent when you have a dorky looking kid that can bang things in from the Twilight Zone with a carefree aloofness attached to the uncanny ability. Roth could provide back-breakers and psychological damage…dishearten a team with a couple his perfectly timed cannon shots right at the best moment an opponent that has scratched and clawed its way back from a deficit. You can’t put a value on the mental anguish of a Roth bomb into a stat column. It’s only 3 points…but when he’s shaking hands with Crean while it’s in the air, decides to tighten up a loose shoelace, turns to begin a casual stride with his back turned to the hoop as the guide missile finally shreds the nets, it has a lingering demoralizing effect on more than Newton’s law..The defying of gravity adds a bit more gravity to the opponent’s already less-than-stable nerve.

    Do I make a phone call to Roth for a bit of that “gravity?” Do I push another Capo off to Northwest Indiana? Cody’s getting so damn “soft”…why should we have cared if he got pissed when we gently shoved Etherington to Island of Misfit Forwards? Maybe getting him angry would have made him play more like the POY Laffy was 100% confident he had the “stones” to support…? Push off Austin to be bench warmer on a Horizon League team…? Start ‘A-Hope for Track Stars’ and put Jurkin on the IU 400 meter relay team..?

    I guess it all boils down to how bad you want that 6th banner? Is it worth a few sins you’ll have to ask Joyce for forgiveness?

  47. I will also say this…I’ve finally enjoyed a conversation with you, Laffy.

    No harm, no foul..No tweet, no sheet…I think we both just discovered a wee bit of faith.

  48. Peter Jurkin doing the Fosbury Flop..? Sounds like my New Year’s Eve.

  49. unless we figure out how to fit our best players in at the right time we will not have the success we should. Our 4 position is a mystery to Coach. Please figure it out or we will lose and often

  50. Scotty, not sure if you want to venture into it or not, but do you have an opinion on what to do at the 4?

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