IU grabs second straight Big Ten road win

WHAT HAPPENED: With a strong defensive effort and four scorers in double figures, Indiana easily held on despite a miserable second half to beat Penn State 74-51 in front of 9,386 at the Bryce Jordan Center in State College, Pa.

The Hoosiers went on a 15-3 lead to start the game and never really looked back. They were up 31-13 by the 9:41 mark in the first half, and Penn State was never again closer than 12 points, despite the fact that the Hoosiers turned the ball over 12 times in the second half and attempted just 15 field goals.

WHO MADE IT HAPPEN: Senior forward Christian Watford played perhaps his most aggressive game in recent weeks, attacking the rim on the game’s first possession and scoring inside and out to finish with 16 points and eight rebounds, knocking down three 3-pointers and also dishing out two assists.

Senior guard Jordan Hulls found his shooting groove again after an 0-for-10 outing at Iowa on Monday. He was 4-for-6 from the field with a pair of 3-pointers and 14 points.

Sophomore center Cody Zeller finished with 15 points and five rebounds, but was even more important on defense than offense. He finished with two blocks and four steals, including one steal in the backcourt that led to an easy fast-breakdunk. Junior guard Victor Oladipo also finished with 10 points.

Freshman point guard Yogi Ferrell scored just one point and was 0-for-5 from the field, but he may have been one of the game’s most important players. He drew the assignment of Penn State’s top perimeter option, point guard D.J. Newbill, stuck on his right hand and held him to 3-for-15 shooting and just eight points and three assists against five turnovers.

WHY DID IT HAPPEN: The Nittany Lions are noticeably short-handed with All-Big Ten point guard Tim Frazier, their do-everything player a year ago, out for the season with a ruptured Achilles tendon. That leaves Penn State without a lot of firepower, and Indiana took full advantage of that fact.

Though he was giving up four inches or possibly more to Newbill, Ferrell hounded the sophomore transfer from Southern Mississippi, taking away his right-hand whenever he could. The Hoosiers also did a brilliant job of helping on any and all occasions when Ferrell got beat and also did a solid job of trapping off of ball screens, making it difficult for Newbill or anyone else to make their lives easier that way. Zeller was very strong in that regard, protecting the rim but also hedging and trapping hard in the backcourt to create turnovers.

The Hoosiers had major offensive issues in the second half, missing free throws and turning the ball over, but it didn’t matter because the defense was strong throughout and Penn State was never able to capitalize on the opportunities they did have. The Nittany Lions actually won the rebounding battle with 35 rebounds to Indiana’s 33 and 17 offensive boards, but they managed just 14 second-chance points and often missed from point-blank range. Penn State shot just 31.7 percent from the field, including 28.6 percent in the second half.

WHAT DOES IT MEAN: The Hoosiers got back-to-back Big Ten road wins for the first time since 2008. Penn State’s cavernous Bryce Jordan center was just over half-full according to attendance figures and didn’t look or sound that well-populated. Point being, there are clearly tougher places to win on the road than State College, but all the same, the Hoosiers have begun their season with two road victories, and it’s become quite evident that there won’t be many easy road victories this season. Still, the Hoosiers also showed some vulnerabilities they will have to sure up by Saturday’s home game against Minnesota, a very athletic outfit and a strong rebounding team. The Golden Gophers were the only team to beat the Hoosiers in Assembly Hall last year.


Tom Crean

“Extremely proud of our team’s effort defensively, on the road, to come in and hold a team under 32 percent shooting. … Bottom line is we defended for 40 minutes. The 3-point line. We game-planned hard for Newbill, for Marshall, for Taylor, for Collella. We could’ve done a better job on Travis for sure. We had some plans for their inside game, and our guys were extremely locked in to that. They were extremely locked in, and learned another valuable lesson in the sense that even sometimes when your shot’s not there, or when your free throw isn’t there, or when your decision making’s not there, as long as your defense is there, you’ve got a chance to continue to stay in the game.”

On Yogi Ferrell’s defense

“Extremely happy. Yogi’s drawing big assignments. D.J. Newbill is really good. When you start to think that he’s a sophomore, I mean, he’s really good. When you start to think that he’s a sophomore, I mean, he’s really good. He’s got some serious strengths. Our job was to do the best job we could do to not let him get to those. A lot of things obviously run through him and run through Marshall. They’re both very, very good players. … Yogi Ferrell is the epitome of somebody that’s been well-coached, a disciplined player that has great speed and quickness and just a presence and really, really wants to be a good defender, a big-time defender.’

On Christian Watford

“We wanted to get him going,” IU coach Tom Crean said. “We went to him right off the bat. We felt that that was a big part of our game plan and he responded. … We want him to hunt offense by movement and reading what’s there. I think he did a great job of that, whether it was getting to the rim, whether it was making 3’s, the post-up game. He did an extremely good job, and he was one of our catalysts defensively.”

On Jordan Hulls

“I thought he really, really went to his pull-up tonight rather than shooting a floater or a push runner. There’s a place for that, but he’s got such a great shot, that you want to make sure that he’s getting that last bounce, that he’s getting his hand through the ball, that his follow through is good, and he did that, and he had that kind of week.”

On the turnovers

“Those were self-inflicted. Those were unforced errors, and they were errors of guys trying to make plays. I don’t think it was trying to do too much. We didn’t trust a couple of things. We didn’t get out there and sprint. It almost was like a 3-on-2 fastbreak drill in practice, which is not always the best. We want to be out running.”

Yogi Ferrell

On guarding D.J. Newbill

“I knew which way he wanted to go,” Ferrell said. “He’s a right-hand dominant player, so I just pretty much take that away. … I just took away his right-hand pretty much, and it worked out for the best.”

Jordan Hulls

“My teammates put a lot of confidence in me, and they knew last game was difficult. It happens, so we were able to get through that. They had my back with that, and just seeing the first one fall was pretty good.”

AUDIO: Tom Crean

AUDIO: Christian Watford

AUDIO: Yogi Ferrell

AUDIO: Jordan Hulls

AUDIO: Pat Chambers


  1. Another very solid road win, basically over in 10 min. This was the first game of the season where we came out and ran away in the first 5 min. & never looked back. Very impressive 1st half.

    On the other hand, we were pathetic in the 2nd half. Two points, if I’m not mistaken, in the first Pre-TO segment to the under 16 min mark. The team was clearly flat, aside from Olidipo who got things cooking again.

    Yogi played absolutely stifling defense. I was shocked he only had 1 pt., but he & Olidipo are one hell of a defensive backcourt. This is why we should dispatch Ohio St. In particular. But these two are tough to handle.

    The rebounding is weak. No passion to go rip the ball off the glass. This leads to too many opponent possessions. In tight, must-stop situations, this team needs to be tougher on the glass. Period.

    Kudos to CWat, best he’s played in a long, long time. Keep it up kid. More nights like this will result in a Big 10 title.

    Now to Zeller….not that we anointed the kid Player of the Year preseason, but he is not the best player in college basketball by a long shot. Not even the Big 10 POY. Clearly needs another year to grow his game. If he does go pro, it’ll be another example why pro ball sucks….it’s not about basketball as we know it. Z should be a triple double threat every night, but he’s weak on the boards. Played great D, ran the floor well tonight. But missed plenty of RB, turned the ball over so many times, and missed FTs again. Not a dominant player, and I’m not sure he should be at 19 yrs. old & a soph.

    Can’t wait for a BIG MN payback game Sat.!

  2. A spot-on analysis, AZ. Couldn’t agree more. The only thing I would add is a lack of rotation. I thought Hollowell was steady in the few minutes he played, but where was Parea and Elston? (Parea at least got in the game. Did I miss an injury report on Elston?) I’ll say it again: When you’re up big at halftime and are never really threatened after that, why are we not getting the reserves more time?

  3. Elston tweaked his knee again****was held out as a precautionary measure.

    AWinAZ: Very good breakdown of IU’s game tonight.

    On Cody, maybe he has “ZEEK” disease. Isaiah Thomas throughout his freshman and 1st half of his sophmore year played great in fits and spurts. Then he became the opposing team’s nightmare for the rest of 1981. We know how that turned out. I’ve seen numerous IU players follow the same trajectory before and after Zeek. In summation, Cody is a very good player who makes fellow teammates better when he is on the floor.

  4. I think one thing that needs to be remembered about Cody is the fact that last year and this year are the first time he is truly playing a post position. Most of his HS and AAU career was actually played away from the basket and rarely under the basket. I didn’t get to see the game last night because my daughter had a bball game last night. It sounded like IU was playing down to their competition and was disinterested in the second half. Fish and Coach were even saying that on the radio broadcast as I was driving home. Crean mentioned on the radio that his biggest issue with the offensive boards that Penn St. got was because not all five guys were crashing the boards and when they did get the board weren’t strong with the ball and would lose it. Sounds like defense was solid the entire game. A questions to Penn St., how do you not have guards at the D1 level that can handle a trap or pressure?

  5. If Cody wants to stay another year, and tweak his game, you won’t see my crying. With some development, I could see him being a positive influence to our freshman next season.

  6. I read an interesting article the other day about Cody. I think it was ESPN but I’m not sure. Sorry. It basically compared him to Drew Gooden, from Kansas. He exploded on to the scene in’01 as a soph with a very similar skillet. Gooden stayed one more year, vastly improved his strength and rebounding, ended up 2nd for POY to Jay Williams, and helped lead KU to the Final Four in ’02. Then went on to a relatively successful career in the NBA.

    At this stage, Cody looks more like a project for an NBA team than an All-Star. I think with another year or two, with his game continuing to mature and the poise and headlines he already displays, I think he could eventually compare more favorably to a Tim Duncan.

    The last thing I want to see is another Kirk Haston, who jumped to the pros a little too early and ended up playing a few years in obscurity. Can’t speak for the man, but you have to wonder if he didn’t look back and regret that his presence probably would’ve put us over the top against Maryland title game the following year.

    Cody’s got a good thing going here, and I think the sky’s the limit. I hope he makes the right decision.

  7. That game was “The Good, The Bad and the Ugly”. But a road win.

    Numbers; 94 turnovers since the Butler game. Actually last night was somewhat better at 13. 19 last game.

    * Yahoo sports noted IU was the B1G’s best rebounding team. Did not realize that, if correct.

    * Coach Crean was open for a couple of two pointers last night. Seemed as if we had 6 players on the floor at times. Would be confusing if we had black uniforms such as Cincinnati.

    *IUHoosier tagged it. Seemed as if we playing to the level of the opponent in the second half.

    * The thing with Cody. He is not a surprise this year. Teams are learning how to neutralize him. Still, he is effective just being in the game. Ball handling, speed and BB knowledge. The guy is good.

    * Like to see more time for Remy. No misses, a steal and 2 assists last night.

    Minn game. KenPom has IU #1 and Minn #8. RPI has IU #14 and Minn #8. HoopsMath has Minn #7 with “field goal % at rim” and IU at #18. We’ll probably find out what “level” we are playing at. Must win at home..?

  8. sorry. 17 turnovers last night. Not 13. (Lost a couple of fingers as a kid and forgot to compensate)

  9. iuhoosier1992,
    They may not have anyone to handle the pressure now but they lost All Big Ten guard Tim Frazier to a torn Achilles tendon in November. He was as good as anyone in the league IMHO.

  10. Does their “best rebounding team” include just Big Ten games or our entire schedule?

    Either way…….so what?

    If it’s just the Big Ten, we’ve played 2 games against 2 of the worst teams.

    If it’s the whole schedule, we’ve played a ton of cupcakes.

  11. Well driving back from PA so I have a bit of time in the car…

    First off, it was great meeting Dustin and Mass Hoosier. We got together for a few at Champs before the game (although Dustin, always the consummate professional, only had water). Sorry I didn’t see your question Coachv, I wouldn’t been happy to share a beer and a story with you as well.

    As far as the game goes… Ugh. I thought the biggest issue was atmosphere. I feel sorry for PSU players. They have to generate all their own energy. What awful fan support. There couldn’t have been more than 5,000 fans in there at the peak, and in a 16,000 seat stadium it just felt empty… No noise, no enthusiasm, no energy… Even when they announced the starters you could barely hear any applause over the PA guy and the music. Second half was worse… All the students left at half time and there were maybe 2,000 in the stands for the last 15 minutes. Granted it is a football area, and the national championship game was starting, so that couldn’t have helped, but still it was just so blah in there.

    I think that contributed to poor play – IU always had a comfortable lead, and there was nothing forcing them to play with a sense of urgency. No intensity in the building, hardly any intensity exhibited by PSU players… Our host was my buddy who coaches soccer there, and he expressed his disappointment in how little effort the PSU kids appeared to play with on defense. He knows Coach Chambers a bit and is really impressed with how he has approached trying to build a team and how he runs his practices, but he thought the players really let the coach down with their actual effort on the court last night.

    The game is hardly worth talking about at all. I thought Zeller looked really good, especially on defense. He continues to back up my statement that he is better than any big man in recent history at guarding high ball screens. He was also impressive protecting the rim. I thought Perea did a really nice job defensively as well… They challenged him a bit more, but he altered a couple shots and was pretty good helping and recovering on ball screens.

    My last note is as a Dipo-apologist. My theory is that this wasn’t his best game because he didn’t have a big defensive assignment to gear up for. He is so used to having to take away the other teams top perimeter scorer and creating a mindset of intimidation and domination. Yogi had that assignment last night, and I think Dipo had a hard time adjusting, which added into the lack of excitement in the building, left Dipo with nothing to feed off of.

    By the way, Dustin is an animal during the games. Moderating the live chat, typing in game updates, taking notes for his stories, following Twitter, all while carrying on a conversation with me.

    … Well my dad’s buddy took over behind the wheel, and has almost got in 3 wrecks as I’ve been typing this. Just hoping to make it back to Maine alive. Got our first baby in the oven and I really need to make it back for my wife. Everyone please say a little prayer for me… Or whatever is is you do Laffy.

  12. Couple other thoughts…

    IU looked really good in man-to-man, and really bad in zone.

    Obviously defensive rebounding was not a strength last night, but I do remember at one point when I was particularly disgusted I did a quick personnel check and our 5 on the floor were Yogi, Hulls, Abell, Sheehey, and Zeller… I think they picked up about 5 or 6 of their offensive boards during that stretch. Is opulent go with that line-up again in a game that mattered.

  13. I pray……just not to an invisible sky daddy who sends people to hell for 10 trillion years for not believing a stupid fairy tale with no proof.

    Prayers to ya and your family.

    Thanks for your thoughts on the game.

  14. And you didn’t know about that horrible atmosphere at PSU before you ever bought a dozen tickets?

    If I didn’t know better(because there is sane or sensible reason to drive on winter roads for that amount of distance, lower Maine to Happy Valley)you made the trip to simply have a chance to schmooze with Dustin…The extremes a man will go to build his Scoop kingdom. Boy, oh, boy…The necessary steps it takes to remodel Hampton Court Scoop to properly crown the new king from the Northeast countryside. Could somebody get him a juicy turkey leg and a goblet our finest Laffy Orchards whine? Just love the way Goeff is easing back off the “Cody is soft” bandwagon…You know what the hell is soft? Every domino in the “Movement” that followed notoriety on Zeller’s coattails to Bloomington.


    Was it Geoff’s unflattering patchy Dakich baldness or did he have a fauxhawk that screamed of cockatoo envy more than that thing Kartje spent hours stylizing every Hoosier Morning into a Hoosier Brunch?

    Is it just me or does Punkjab have a bit of bite in his tongue eerily familiar to the sound of Karen from Hoosier Hoopsta?

    Wow..Perea has currently shown me zero offensive game. How does that happen with so much hype? Without Yogi, and the subsequent loss of Patterson, where did this recruiting class really deserve to be ranked…Give me Matt Roth and Ron Patterson over the whole damn rest of projects and “softies.” Hollowell = Soft, Jurkin = Tijan, Perea = misplaced Cupcake team recruit.

    Karen is correct. Too much substituting in Crean’s so-called top recruiting class while screwing Elston out of his minutes; minutes that could help us far more in March than soft freshman and crudely developed basketball projects.

    Hopefully none of our future top recruits begin to bail…What is left on this team after the departure of Watford, Hulls, and Cody is a scary thought. Yogi and Remy? That’s enough left on a roster for any coach other than John Calipari to convince top talent to get the crap beat out of them on the road in the Big 10?

    Huh…? Appears Watford and Hulls are performing to my exacting predictions. Real talent never forces issues…They bring the same demeanor every night. They don’t put three fingers to their temples or plug their nose when they make an average play. They just prove season after season to be the true solid talent and backbone of a team when all the hype magnates to the showboats.

    Geoff- Congrats on baby Cosell. So cold and isolated are the winters in Maine. No matter how distasteful the thought, biological instincts cannot be curtailed.

  15. I echo Geoff’s comments. Good time Meeting Geoff and Dustin last night. Dustin had his game face on.
    To summarize, Indiana played good Defense. PSU didn’t play well because of it. Indiana seems indecisive at times, a problem with so much talent. But that talent enables them to dominate in spurts. Just to many miscues and unforced turnovers.
    I must admit I was let down by the atmosphere in the Bryce Jordan Center. I have come to terms with how opposing(good) football teams fans feel when visiting Memorial Stadium. Haha, hopefully thats changing.
    It was great gathering with fellow Hoosier fans, and watching our team. Safe travels Geoff. Dustin, thanks for taking the time to talk with us. I know you had work on your mind and were ready to get with it.

  16. Harvey

    1) didn’t buy a single ticket. They were gifts from the PSU athletic department.

    2) the 9 hour drive is no big deal when you’re hanging with one of your best friends in the world who is a great story teller and can make you piss your pants laughing.

    3) if the trip had only been about the game it wouldn’t have been worth it, but I got to hang out with my best friend, my brother who lives in Asheville and I only see a couple times a year, got to give my father the gift of seeing another IU game live, see a cousin I hadn’t seen in 15 years, meet Dustin, meet another Scoop member Mass Hoosier (great guy), and probably the coolest part of the trip, get the VIP tour of all the athletic facilities including meeting most of the coaching and training staffs for about half the teams at PSU. Got to meet Kael Sanderson, have an extended conversation with Bob Warming (Tsao youre probably a fan of his), and hang out with Erica Walsh, whose house we stayed at.

    4) once again you put words in my mouth… I never said Cody was soft. I said I want him to play tougher, and that he hasn’t been playing like a MAN. I never throw out opinions I don’t think through thoroughly… I don’t think there is much chance of me backing off any of my stances. You may perceive me doing that because you completely make up half of my stances and of course I won’t be standing by those.

    5) thanks. My wife and I are thrilled. You may remember that she’s a breast cancer survivor, and the chemo did a number on her insides, so it’s literally a miracle we’re in this position now. Due in late May… Little baby boy.

  17. Geoff–

    HH is just worried you’re going to get too cozy with Dustin and he won’t be his BFF anymore.

    He’s also jealous of anyone getting more attention on here than him.

  18. My dad can’t drive either… Wow. It took us 3 exits to find a place to grab lunch because He was trying to go off memory… His first exit there was a lake and a dam where he swore he remembered a Burger King being. Next exit down he saw a sign for a McDonalds, but refused to go more than a half mile in either direction off the exit to track it down…. A u-ey in 4 lanes of traffic and drove up over the opposite curb. We go back over the highway to see if it’s there and don’t immediately see it, so he pulls into a 7-11 then goes thru the parking lot to a perpendicular street that has a light where we can get to the other side of the median and back to I-84 east… Except that he decides to stay all the way to the left… Not a one way street, and now he’s blocking oncoming traffic. Not pretty. Finally we take another exit that has an actual golden arches sign we can see in the distance. It’s in a strip mall parking lot and my father only realizes where it is at the last second, so he yanks across 2 lanes of traffic at 40 mph into this parking lot barely missing the curb again.

    Luckily he’s only hit the rumble strip once as he was trying to show Mike how to use the CD player…

    I can’t wait to kiss my driveway…

  19. Geoff wrote; “What awful fan support. There couldn’t have been more than 5,000 fans in there at the peak, and in a 16,000 seat stadium it just felt empty… No noise, no enthusiasm, no energy… Even when they announced the starters you could barely hear any applause over the PA guy and the music. Second half was worse… All the students left at half time and there were maybe 2,000 in the stands for the last 15 minutes.”

    Kind of ironic that PSU football fans have exactly the same feelings about IU’s football team. A few years back, I tailgated with a bunch of people at the IU-PSU game in Bloomington. It’s the one that IU had a good chance to win, but fumbled away in the fourth quarter. After the game, some PSU fans were with us and one gentleman said, “gosh, I feel sorry for your football team, your team played very well and should have won this game, but the IU fan support is just pathetic.” During that game, I remember thinking that there were as many blue and white clad fans in the stadium as there were fans dressed in crimson and cream. And even though IU was playing them tough and the game was close, at half time, most of IU students and many of the older fans left Memorial Stadium to go and tailgate.

    Fan support, passion and attendance matters a lot. We have it for basketball, we need it for football.

  20. I don’t remember you mentioning that she was a cancer survivor…That’s wonderful, Geoff.

    With all sincerity, congrats on your new son. I hope everything goes well.

    I’m sure you know that most of that rant was just my extreme jealousy erupting..


    Penn State is lucky to have guys like Dustin and you to represent with dignity their institution…Makes truly hard to believe how the powers at the top can make it all go so horribly wrong. So immersed in national headlines reflecting a deep infestation of deeds beyond hideous character and a dieseased culture permeating the most prominent traditions of their athletic program. The fans are lucky to have that hard-nosed basketball coach…Though I have no idea, Chambers does not appear to be the sort of man to bow to anyone for the sake of winning, image, our more deadbeats in the seat.

    The uninspired Penn State basketball fans against a top 10 team is a sign all is not well in Happy Valley. It shows a real disrespect for second chances and spoiled rotten mentality that lacks humility. It confirms to me a thick belief that society has long ago sold out and that power and influence only momentarily be derailed. That basketball stadium should have been overflowing with the gratitude of something left worth cheering for.

  21. Not sure what was up with Elston, but I’ll say this, he was not going hard in warm-ups, didnt really jump on his lay-up attempts, and never took off his shooting shirt that I remember.

  22. It’s a little odd Harvard… I thought they’d pack the place for IU. We went down to the BJC around 1 pm and met one of the AD’s and she thought it would be a really big crowd – around 14 or 15k.

    They sold out every home women’s volleyball game this fall. Every wrestling match was sold out prior to the season starting, and they’ve had standing room only on the actual event days. They have no problem filling a 108,000 seat football stadium.

    This is my friends first year at PSU so he was never part of any of the previous regimes, attitudes, etc, but he has been blown away by the feeling of community and collective pride that permeates Happy Valley. He’ll be playing in an annual wheel chair basketball game for charity on Thursday night at the BJC and they’ve already sold something like 5,000 tickets…

    When Chambers first got into town he walked all over campus introducing himself to everyone and personally inviting them to go watch the team play. Did the same thing the first 2 weeks of school this year…

    For whatever reason the support just hasn’t extended over to the basketball program yet.

  23. Geoff-

    Maybe the crowd would have been a lot better if the game would have been on ESPN…?

    Assembly Hall is one of the rare places on the planet that doesn’t need a contract with the Establishment media to fill every seat. Probably why they hate us so much.


    STRATEGY QUESTION(going forward): Considering the rawness of the A-Hope recruits and the ‘iffiness’ Elston’s future 2013 season, do you agree with many that keep pushing to get them on the floor?

    I’m in the opposite camp. I believe the rotations should be substantially narrowed. I believe in a starting five working large chunks of minutes together. Chemistry and synergy needs to develop..I would limit the minutes of Elston..I wouldn’t push Purea and Jurkin. I would concentrate wholly on Sheehey, Remy, and Hollowell as my primary bench minutes..Rotate Watford to the post if Cody gets in foul trouble. I would even bring in the kid from Westfield to bang and back up Cody(not when Cody needs a rest, but in intense minutes a heated battle).

    This team is disjointed. There was too much sitting out with the 9 game suspension to get the A-Hope guys up to speed. It’s Big 10 season. Experimentation time is over. Thank the NCAA and hype for the setback

    Could Elston still be redshirted? I would love having a healthy Elston back next year.

  24. The tickets were “gifts from the PSU athletic department?” And you regularly have contacts with high school b-ball recruits and coaches from Massachusetts private academy programs? Are you possibly functioning as a PSU recruiter cloaked as an IU fan?

    Wouldn’t that be some sort of NCAA violation at IU?

  25. Coach Crean was open for a couple of two pointers last night. Seemed as if we had 6 players on the floor at times. Would be confusing if we had black uniforms such as Cincinnati.

    Yeah, the man is an absolute lunatic, isn’t he?

  26. Personally I think Perea should continue to get minutes. I think he can help this year. We have so many offensive weapons that as long as he can rebound and defend the rim for 10-15 minutes a game that is perfect. I especially think he is important if Elston can’t give us 100%. We need some depth up front and your essentially eliminating al of it with this strategy.

    The kid from Westfield I assume is Howard. I don’t mind him getting minutes in a pinch, but I’d rather see Perea on the floor getting experience. Jurkin is a project, and I don’t think you have to worry at all about him seeing a single meaningful minute.

    I only think Elston helps us if he is 100% healthy. He isn’t a good enough athlete to make up for it if he isn’t, and we know he needs minutes to get any level of comfort on the floor… Unfortunately it’s too late in the season to work him into a comfort zone.

    I’m actually higher on Perea than Hollowell… JH just looks like he is over thinking everything to me. I get the feeling he can’t leave the last play behind him. He is only shooting 16% from 3 and has a 1:6 assist to TO ratio… But more importantly to this discussion is that Hollowell has the presence of a wing. He has the game of a wing. We are deep at wing. Perea has the presence of an interior player and we need that.

  27. Probably on to something there Harv…

    And clearly I’m doing an excellent job. I’m pretty sure everything is a NCAA violation if IU is tied to it. My guess is Remy will have to sit 5 games for this one.

  28. Good analysis, Geoff.

    Your view is more anchored in logic….I sorta like the idea of throwing Howard into some fire.

    I think Cody can handle most the duties down low without Perea getting twelve minutes per game. We have extremely good athletes at the wings and a big guard that comes off the bench that can slash in for extra boards(As Crean has stated, Remy may be the best athlete on the floor…In relation to his very select minutes, he pulls down a lot of loose change).

    All in all, I think you’re right. Give Perea a bit more chance to get comfortable…He definitely provides an imposing figure with unbelievable reach to swat at anything heading to the hoop.

    Do you remember how the happenstance of VJ’s injury seemed to be the perfect medicine for team synergy..? I don’t mean it as a total outright criticism of Jones…I just believe the thinner rotation influenced the final product in a very positive fashion down the stretch. Some of the setbacks that have limited our bench selection may be a blessing in disguise. Hard to imagine how the minutes would have been managed with Patterson, Perea, Elston, Hollowell, Etherington, and Creek all mopey-eyed staring down the bench at Crean.

    Can you be too deep? I like something that resembles a bit of stick-to-it-iveness seven or eight guys.

  29. Before you dig into that…I know, you’re not necessarily looking at it as an either/or proposition with Cody and Hanner…Using them together may provide the best results.

  30. geoff,

    almost went to champs before the game. lady at the desk at our hotel suggested it as a place where we might run into iu fans before the game. i was skeptical and wanted to be closer to campus rather than a chain/cookie cutter bar. ended up at a place called “the corner”.

    right on about the attendance. no wonder the big 10 leads the country in attendance, what with grossly overstating the numbers and all.

    watching the second half was like trying to walk through quicksand. the play was bad enough, and compounded with the dreadful zombies in the “crowd”. i longed for a cyanide capsule with a tequila chaser. last game i went to at psu was in mike davis’ final season. same atmosphere, so i wasn’t surprised.

    i dragged my pregnant wife and baby along for the ride. my son’s first iu game in person. did you hear him yelling “IU!” over and over? he’s a solid commit for the class of 2029. point guard.

  31. Geoff, just getting to the Scoop and got as far as the ‘kid’! Way to go, had been wondering if you got off the internet or reading ‘Basketball News’ long enough to get a family going.

    Congratulations! (As a friend would say, (roll eyes). No greater experience, or challenge. Congrats to the Mrs. Have a suggestion for a first name…’Dipo’ (as in the Marx Bros; Zeppo, Harpo, Groucho and Gummo)

    Watch the video of the press conference with Zeller and Yogi. Look at their mannerisms and body language. Interesting and revealing dynamic. Had seen it before.

  32. Geoff, I do remember (and knew) Bob Warming from the 70’s. My knowledge of Penn State soccer is Walter Bahr and his sons (two of whom kicked EPs in the NFL). Walter was a former player with the US national team that beat England 1-0 in the 1950 World Cup in what was then the ‘biggest upset in history’, and a teammate of one of my greatest friends (just recently passed), the great Harry Keough, the 5-time NCAA championship coach at St. Louis U.

    I met Warming when he was a senior goalkeeper at Berea College at a camp run at UK by Julio Mazzei (Pele’s coach at Santos and, later coach of the NY Cosmos), also a very close friend. If I recall Warming started coaching at Transylvania U. and went on to Creighton before PSU. Good man, he’s doing well.

  33. Not that Bob would have made any big deal of it, but it’s my understanding he literally built Creighton soccer into the power it is today, brick by brick including the stadium.

    He was very warm to my brother and I, and acted like he was seeing old friends. Really great way about him. Was really knowledgeable about IU hoops… That’s when he got into his roots in Kentucky and how basketball is in his blood. Ribbed us a little because he’s on the other end of two rivalries – PSU soccer and UK basketball.

    Was fun to meet him. I figured you’d at least know of him, and had probably crossed paths.

  34. Pak, N. Korea was well ahead of the US in soccer in 1966. It had already qualified for the 1964 Olympics (though, I believe they later withdrew), finished well in the Asian quals, and lost by only two (5-3) to Portugal in the game that would have put them in the quarter finals.

    The US, in 1950, was very new to a ‘popular’ soccer following, not sure that it had gone much past a ‘club’ game and players like Walter Bahr playing for amateur clubs like the Germanians, and the US captain of the US team that beat England was working as a postman to make ends meet.

    I was a kid in Argentina and reading that the US had beaten England was a major, major, major surprise. N. Korea may not be a soccer power, but I do not ever remember Argentina or Brazil ever taking N. Korea as a sure win.

    Things have changed now. The US is more and more competitive as generations of kids grow up with soccer and the game has become entrenched in the market place. I think in another 10-20 years the US could be a major power if the leadership of soccer does a decent job.

  35. Pak, sorry, left out the following:

    the sentence, “…and the US captain of the US team that beat England was working as a postman…”should have read, “…and Harry Keough, the US captain of the US team along with Bahr, that beat England in 1950 was working as a postman…”

  36. Whatever minuscule knowledge/familiarity I had of soccer ended with Pelé.

    Has there been anyone better, Tsao?

    I did sorta get into the women’s national soccer team when they had the Hamm girl. Was she the one that would rip off her shirt after a victory?

  37. Congrats on your wife Geoff. The LORD has blessed you richly with a baby, and healed your wife. :).

    Laffy, please don’t mock the LORD. If you don’t believe in him, that’s your right. I do, and love him. Your awesome when you talk basketball. Please, I am begging you,, talk basketball. If so etching or so done bugs you, let it ride. You have a good basketball mind.

  38. Tsao, Tsao … (or, rather, Tsk, tsk, tsk…)

    OK, how about USA – Argentina 3-0 on 07/14/95 in Copa America (hosted by Uruguay). Do you remember that Tsao? Golazo de Alexi Lalas for 2-0! The one and only Panayotis Alexander Lalas (what a beautiful name, eh?) who was playing for Udinese in Italy at the time. And who else scored the other two goals for the US: Fotios (“Frank”) Klopas (born in Greece, came to the US at the age of 8) and Eric Wynalda (of unquestionable Dutch ancestry).

    USA – England 1-0 in 1950 was an upset for sure but not bigger than Brazil losing the cup at home in that same tournament! Who was England in 1950? Maybe by comparison it was not even today’s Kentucky or UNC (in basketball). In soccer the English are always overrated. Always, always, always. If you truly are an Argentinian you will not dispute that. Hungary beat them 6-3 on Wembley three years later in 1953. What major competition did England ever win? You can’t in good conscience say “World Cup 1966” but if you do … I only have three words for you: Antonio Ubaldo Rattín.

    That USA – England 1-0 in 1950’s World Cup in Brazil is considered an upset is just a European and South-American arrogance. Take a look at the US roster in 1950: three players from Ponta Delgada (Portuguese). One from Chicago Slovaks. One from Brooklyn Hispano. And so on. It’s like today when we have Zlatan Ibrahimovic playing for Sweden (truly a Swedish citizen but born in Sweden to a Bosnian father and a Croatian mother). Same thing with the 1950 US team. Gaetjens born in Haiti. Gardassanich had started at Reggina in Italy. And so on. They had plenty value. It’s just that the system at that time in the US combined with the public’s lack of interest for soccer in the US did not allow them to prove it more often. (Compare Di Stefano playing for Millonarios with the Di Stefano who player at Real. Wasn’t it smary for Don Alfredo to go to Spain?) Besides, the game in question also featured England which, as always, was basically a big, emphatic nothing.

    1776 was also a big upset, no?

  39. No, signor Harvard, that was Brandi Chastain. But that just shows to Mr. Tsao how soccer was perceived here in the 1950s. (He says he was in Argentina at the time). Hamm, Harvard, was truly truly good. A Michael Jordan of sorts, really. Sadly the male chauvinistic public is unable to remember anything besides the 1999 Brandi Chastain moment and that simply because it involved a bra.

  40. Ademir…beating England 1-0 in 1950 was indeed (in my opinion) the greatest upset in soccer when, in fact, most US players were amateurs (in the 1950 world cup, US players were paid $100 per week). None had professional experience.

    Yes, Uruguay beating Brazil at Maracana in 1950 in front of 200,000+ Brazilians who wanted to slice their arteries was an upset, but an upset of ‘equals’, unlike US v England. Uruguay had already won one World Cup and, though beating Brazil was considered a big upset, it was nothing close to the US 1- England 0(IMHO).

    Two great friends, Walter Bahr (former Penn State coach) and Harry Keough (former St. Louis University- RIP) were part of that game. I’m attaching a link to a NY Times article you may enjoy: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/10/sports/soccer/10soccer.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

    They were as American as Americans get (given we all came from somewhere. Harry was raised in a neighborhood of Irish, Italian and Spanish (from Spain) families called ‘the Hill’ where everyone played soccer; including two of the greatest American baseball legends ever, Yogi Berra- the great Yankees catcher, and Joe Garagiola. Hope you enjoy the article. (The picture shows both Walter and Harry) during the game.

    Good luck

    p.s. I grew up watching Di Stefano (hated him- he was River, I was Boca). Loved DiStefano with Puskas and the great Real Madrid team, and the Hungarian national team (which, ironically, never won a WC). I do agree Barcelona now is a better team.

  41. Nonsense.

    North Korea: most isolated country in the world. First time ever participating to a World Cup in 1966 beats Italy 1-0. Italy already twice World Champions (1934, 1938) by that time and North Korea the absolute outsider.

    By contrast US and England share language, history, culture, traditions. Traditions brought here by those who immigrated. There is only one way in which US – England 1-0 in 1950 can be considered a bigger upset, and that is if the US team had consisted entirely of North Korean immigrants. That I would definitely accept as a bigger upset. As it stands though it’s still an upset but a minor one and definitely not the biggest, because:

    1) England had never won the World Cup, unlike Italy

    2) Unlike North Korea the U.S. team won both the silver and bronze medals in men’s soccer at the 1904 Summer Olympics held in St. Louis, Missouri. (How impressive is that?)

    3) Unlike North Korea, in the 1930 World Cup, won by Uruguay (a significant accomplishment according to Don Tsao) the U.S. finished third, beating Belgium 3–0 at Estadio Gran Parque Central in Montevideo, Uruguay.

    So Tsao is wrong.

    But: whatever.

  42. Don’t care either way… They both sound like upsets… Just wonder what speaking a common language to your opponent has anything to do with losing or winning. That’s a bizarre argument.

  43. Y dale!,…y dale!…y dale, Boca, dale!

    Geoff, we’ve made our peace and I’m glad for it; but your dismissive #51…you earned every bit of the response from Pak Do-ik and Ademir. Comments like that and in that ‘tone’ (in general) had a lot to do with earlier issues. I’m ok, now knowing you, but it would be good if you passed on a sign of greater humility to both Pak and Ademir. Just saying.

  44. Hats off to you Don Tsao. (Swish, swish, swish, sound of hat tearing the air from side to side in sign of respect as I bow to you, my worthy opponent!) You know, checking the World Soccer ELO ratings (e.g., Italy) which is a sort of kenpom I see that USA – England is numerically a slightly bigger upset than North Korea – Italy. Of course, I don’t agree at all with that, but nonetheless I see your point Mr. Tsao (and I could even defend your position if need be). Thank you and Boca forever!

  45. Pak Do-ik…ok, they were BOTH huge, huge upsets. Don’t see a need for either of us to get into a ‘mine is bigger than yours’ argument,…I do clearly remember the N. Korea-Italy (and, in 2010 the 2-1 loss to Brazil. So gradually N. Korea did get quite competitive at the WC.

    The US has tried (they were better than most gave them credit for during the Lalas through Tab Ramos years. They slipped badly in the last Cup and are now working their way back under the coaching of Juergen Klinsmann, the German legend. That was a great decision by the USSF, to bring in Klinsmann.

    Earlier, the US made a serious mistake in that the USFF insisted too soon in being coached by American coaches with little or no international experience too soon. These U.S. coaches were influenced mostly by the English (Scottish, Irish) soccer styles (abuse of the air game, long passes bypassing midfield play and emphasizing wing play, crossing from the corners hoping for a header). The English style- quite a few former Scots, British and Irish coaches came to the US- slowed the development of a ‘US style’ friendlier to skills including short ground passing and dribble penetration. Klinsmann seems to be emphasizing the ‘skill’ game (first introduced here after the success of Holand’s ‘total soccer’ and coaches (Dutch Wiel Coever) systematizing and introducing skill training methods to US soccer.

    It will come. Americans are great athletes and certainly have the infrastructure and facilities for great training. More US coaches, however, need to look at and study the development of tactics and training from innovative international coaching minds like Pepe Guardiola, Cruyff, former Argentina head coaches Jose Pekerman (now with Colombia), Bilbao’s Marcelo Bielsa and Real Madrid’s Mourinho. (I always thought Pekerman would have been great for the US). He speaks good English, and was the coach of three Under-21 World Cup cahmpions and one or two Olympic champions before his stint as National Coach (eliminated in the 2006 quarter-finals in penalty kicks by Germany). The US can be a world power in soccer. It still needs better (tactical) coaching based on styles independent of English influence. (I’m not 100% sure but I don’t think the English have accomplished much in international soccer at the WC level [adult or U-21] since 1966).

    Anyway…as Prof. Mazzei used to say, ‘keep the ball rolling’.

  46. Pak Do-ik- I had not seen your #55 as I was writing #56. I equally bow with pleasure at you and your knowledge of the ‘beautiful game’. My good friend Prof. Mazzei (Pele’s early coach) used to say “always respect the Game by respecting your worthy opponent.” True words.

  47. If anyone else besides Tsao is reading, please stop here (you won’t find this interesting at all)…


    Calling a point of an argument “bizarre” is grounds for being called a bigot?

    I wouldn’t have responded to Pak/Ademir because his/her post was just begging for a reaction, but it’s a little curious that you think I earned it.

    I’m glad we’re getting along as well. Maybe you can help me learn about myself. I wasn’t trying to dismiss the debate, if I was dismissive of it I wouldn’t have bothered even reading the posts in the first place. I actually found it kinda interesting, which is why i guess i responded at all. I thought my statement was just showing I wasn’t taking one side of the debate or the other.

    I simply wonder how does it help that the Americans share a language, culture, and history with the English, but it doesn’t help the English.

    It is bizarre…

    Now I could understand if they didn’t like my tone and called me an a-hole… But a bigot?

  48. Geoff, since you ask. It was a generally dismissive tone of the comment, which could be interpreted- whether you meant to or not is not the point-; the possible interpretation of a statement is always up to the individual receiving it and, thus, should be considered before making it. (Sometimes [frequently??] I violate my own judgment on this point and have to make myself conscious of it).

    I think this is particularly true in cross-cultural contacts, since it is easier to come across the concept of ‘alien’ or ‘different’ thoughts and call them ‘bizarre’.

    The arguments Ademir and Pac Do-ik were making- even if we (they and I disagreed on a specific point)- were perfectly logical, assumptions were valid and well stated. There was nothing ‘bizarre’ about either. The word ‘bizarre’ has a connotation of ‘strangeness’, even ‘deviance’, which certainly you may not have meant but in a cross cultural setting (even within the same culture) can be pretty insulting.

    Out of the exchange of differences, we (Pac Do-ik, Ademir and myself) came out with a common love and new acquaintanceship- perhaps future internet friendship- based on differences as a commonality. That was a point learned from travels…’the greatest universality is the difference’. Your question here perhaps comes from that sphere. Hope so.

    BTW, that’s what makes soccer such a universal passion. We can disagree, argue and add.

    Thanks for asking. I think we’ll all respect that.

  49. Ok, clearly they could have taken me saying that the point was bizarre and concluded I meant that he/she was deviant and alien. I only meant it was a strange argument to make in the context of the debate. Obviously things get lost in translation, especially across cultures…

    Maybe I’m not understanding Pak’s use of the word bigot… I take it to mean racist or prejudiced… Which if it were meant in that way, I would usually take great offense to (unless they were only doing it to get a rise out of me, which is how I took the comment). Is something getting lost in translation there as well? Do you think he/she just trying to say I’m intollerant of others opinions?

  50. Geoff- You can’t take offense at what is ‘thought’ by someone else, especially when you yourself are admitting to seeing the statement as ‘deviant’ and ‘alien’. Perhaps you didn’t mean it in a ‘racist’ way since you can have no idea of what race either is from without seeing them, but any pre-judgment does make you ‘prejudiced’. And, you are the one that takes it as ‘racist or prejudiced’. If you examine your own reaction to the use of words, you’ll understand what may be offensive in how you express yourself to those of other cultures.

    But, and I hope you take advice here…Don’t obsess, all you have to say is ‘I’m sorry, I intended no offense’ and it’s over.

    Look, we will never mean what people hear. We have to allow for, again, differences.

    Just a sincere ‘I’m’ sorry does wonders.

  51. Pak – I’m sorry. I meant no offense.

    Tsao – Not only have I never used the word bizarre to mean ‘deviant’ or ‘alien’, I’ve never once thought of the word in that context… I’m simply taking your word that someone else, especially from another culture, may take it to mean that. It never once occurred to me that someone might take it to mean that. I also don’t think I made any pre-judgement of the person, just a post-judgement of the statement, so I disagree 100% with any conclusion about prejudice. Your last sentence of that first paragraph was pretty interesting, though…

  52. I don’t get the “bigot” comment at all. I suppose you’d have to be an international soccer fan to understand it.

    For that, I am woefully under qualified.

  53. Even if Geoff intended to be dismissive…big friggin’ deal. Like every single one of us hasn’t been arrogant, insulting, or dismissive at some point on this blog. I have zero belief he intended any real harm.

    Anyone claiming to be crafted in perfection on here had their equal shot at being creative enough to think of my screen name.

Comments are closed.