No. 8 Spartans hammer Hoosiers on homecoming, 56-17

Michigan State scored 42 unanswered points and totaled 662 yards in a 56-17 win over Indiana on Saturday at Memorial Stadium.

The Hoosiers head into the bye week winless in the conference, with a game at Michigan looming on Nov. 1. Indiana has not won the Old Brass Spittoon since 2006.

Michigan State outgained Indiana 662-224, with Cook completing 24 of his 32 passes. He was erratic at times, but bailed out by a big day from his receivers.

Tony Lippett caught 7 passes for 123 yards. The Spartans also rushed for 330 yards and five scores.

Indiana true freshman Zander Diamont, making his first career start, completed 5-of-15 passes for 11 yards.

Diamont gave Indiana a 17-14 lead with five minutes remaining in the first half, taking a keeper nine yards to the right for the score. But Michigan State responded with 42 unanswered points, including back-to-back touchdowns in a span of three minutes to close the second quarter.

The Spartans did it with the help of a Hoosier mistake. Michigan State bounced back from Diamont’s touchdown on its ensuing possession, beginning with a 64-yard strike from Cook to Josiah Price down the Spartans’ sideline. On the play, corner Donovan Clark tried to undercut Price and pick off the pass, but whiffed instead. Jeremy Langford punched it in from eight yards out on the next play to give MSU a 21-17 lead.

The Hoosiers went 3-and-out on their next possession and Michigan State followed with a 68-yard drive that ended with a 14-yard connection between Cook and Mcgarrett Kings. Michigan State added second half scores by R.J. Shelton (four-yard reception), Jeremy Langford (12-yard rush), Delton Williams (22-yard rush) and Nick Hill (76-yard rush).

Langford opened the scoring with a 32-yard run in the first quarter, before Indiana answered with a 27-yard field goal by Griffin Oakes.

Cook found Price unwatched over the middle for a 10-yard touchdown pass early in the second quarter to give the Spartans a 14-3 lead.

Indiana answered with a pair of scores, beginning with Shane Wynn’s 75-yard touchdown run off a reverse, followed by Diamont’s nine-yard run.

87 comments

  1. 5-of-15 passes for 11 yards…..? Would that be a Palmolive commercial during a soap opera? This kid’s life is in real danger…He’s just not big enough for this level of hitting. Should really play the walk-on… Shouldn’t have been risking Coleman’s future in the 4th quarter of this one. When it becomes so horrifically one-dimensional, the bull’s-eyes grow very large on the innocent victims (a QB still in a junior high body)and the overused(a running back with a future).

    Gray skies today……No young and restless. Just old and tired of the football drama.slapped together to sell some hand soap..

  2. Something about Diamont makes me think he’ll be an exciting, successful qb in a couple of years. Given time, he’ll be a lot of fun for us Hoosier fans. If he lives that long.

  3. Braved the game out with my family. Transfers or not..you must plan better. It was like not having a qb today and that is unacceptable to fans and not fair to the team. I will go to the next two home football games but it is basketball season in my house. Wilson and staff are gone if they can’t win 6 next year…and next year only because Sudfeld went down or it would be this year. I measure success in wins and losses…and bowl games!

  4. If you are an iu football fan and if you are into into not having anything to do on Saturday afternoon And you love being tortured watch an iu football game.

  5. When Coach Wilson was hired, he was described as “one of the most innovative and prolific offensive minds in the country.” This year I haven’t seen either. It’s time for him to go.

  6. J Pat, you nailed it. I agree with everything you said in #4, especially your comment, “and that is unacceptable to fans and not fair to the team.” I give credit to Diamont for his effort and enthusiasm in extremely difficult circumstances, but the kid should not be seen in a Big Ten football game for another two years or twenty pounds of muscle, whichever comes first. I really fear for his safety through the remainder of this season.

    Today’s game was embarrassing. And for it to be “broadcast” nationally on ESPN was especially painful. It would have been damaging to IU football if anyone had been watching after the first half. I actually felt bad for the commentators today. They were struggling to find any positive things to say about IU’s performance. Thank goodness for Coleman. He continues to be the only highlight in what has turned into another disappointing season.

    Please say a prayer for Spriggs and his doctors.

  7. I can’t tell you how many times the d got best because the defenders were giving 10-15 yard cushions. Then they just outran then into the end zone after the catch. Why not change it up and at least make them go over you. If it doesn’t work so what but do something different!

  8. Let Wilson gone and start over again? You can’t blame the coach for his top 2 QB’s going down with season-ending injuries. If you expecting Wilson, or really any “prolific” offense mind to take a true freshman QB, at his talent level, in his first career college game, and go out and beat a top-10 team, you’re nuts. Diamont was a 3-star prospect out of high school with only a handful of Divison 1 scholarship offers.

    Will Wilson last? Only time will tell. No way, however, he’s gone after this season.

  9. murfman, at the very least, IU will give Wilson one more year. IU will not and should not fire him after this season. But if he does not win six games in his fifth year, he’ll be out of excuses and his job might be in jeopardy. And it’s not his lack of innovation on offense, it’s his lack QB talent this year. In all reality, IU started the season with one QB. And that’s definitely on him. He got caught with his pants down when Tre transferred.

  10. How can you earn a scholarship and go 5-15 for 11 yards? I know for a fact that just about any IU student could have racked up at least that many yards. That is a complete embarrassment. Wilson is on the hook for this for not having an able bodied backup.

  11. Injuries, bad calls and bad luck notwithstanding, I do have to confess to not understanding why we are not making as much progess as we should. I think our defense, with the exception of a few great plays, is not playing with anything close to the killer instinct so vital for a defensive unit. I know we are slow and don’t have the depth and talent of our competitiors yet, but somehow I think we should be doing better.

  12. Harvard,

    You’re absolutly right. We should play the walk-on and let Diamont observe and gain muscle. It’s obvious we’re depleted as far as QB’s go, so redshirting is unfortunately out of the question. The season is lost. It’s obvious. Let the walk-on salvage the season. I also agree it’s insane to let Coleman play when the game is lost. Get him out!

    No way Wilson is gone after this season. We will have options plus Covington and Stevens at QB next season. Let the man fulfil his contract. It’s just unfortunate we have a skeleton crew at QB.

    It seemed the defense held its own for the first half, than just gave up and became gassed. I hated to see this go down on ESPN and on senior day. I’m not giving up. I’ve stuck with this team since a child. I have abandoned any thought of going to a bowl this year. As Harry Carey was fond of saying: “Maybe next year will be the year”.

  13. Glad to hear J Spriggs is ok.
    He had knee complaints after Maryland game.
    Dressed but didn’t play against N Tx
    Got beat at Iowa, Sudfeld blindsided from left, cost the team #1 quarterback for season.
    Highly touted O Line, collapsed today, Diamont constantly scrambling, face it, poor protection.
    No doubt Diamont is green and too small, but he has guts. Lacking adequate protection, he didn’t have a chance. Todays failure began at the O Line and cascaded from there.
    D-line is much improved and so are backers, behind them….not so much.
    The vanishing student section looks terrible on TV.
    Kevin Wilson is the best thing IU has going for it other than the running back(s).
    Give Coach Wilson and extension now. Spend some capital $$$ soon to expand the facilities and get truly competitive. We need to double down, not bail out.

  14. Podunker,

    I’m confident Glass will give Wilson 8 years.(His contract I believe). This isn’t Alabama where after a bad year you’re toast. It would be insane to undue everything he has done. We”re in a position where firing coaches isn’t going to help us. Might as well let him fulfil his vision.

    Thanks for the Spriggs update. Glad the young man is ok. Will see another day.

  15. The QB situation falls squarely on Wilson!! I believe that Tre wasnt happy about the dual QB’s after last season.In my heart of hearts,I think Tre let him know as much. Wilson with his false sense of security of having 2 experienced QB’s got caught with his pants down AND not thinking “What if Tre is serious and opts to leave?” Wilson NEVER thought about or planned for the consequences of Tre transferring.All that LACK of thinking and planning because WILSON thought he was “set” is good reason to fire him and get someone in there that demonstrates respect for the players and less for his EGO

  16. EXCLUSIVE POSTGAME FOOTAGE:

    Zander(a.k.a. “Moochie” among closest of friends and family)keeping a positive attitude while enjoying some cold cuts for dinner after today’s game……@ 3:00 mark of this clip.

  17. coachv,

    Stop telling us what to do when it comes in injured players. Focus on leaving the YMCA coaching gig and achieving your dreams at a High School or Division III. San Francisco needs you. After all, you’re the Rice A Roni treat.

  18. After MSU hit town even a blind man can see why Covington was playing ahead of Diamont. Cornerback is the most prized talent for defenses and as we saw today they tried to be that in the 1st half. When we have CB’s improve like Dutra, Scales and Allen all of a sudden Knorr will be a wizard. But the upgrade is happening before our eyes and it is showing up on ST’s as they are becoming solid. Also did any of you notice the disparaging looks “Hoss” Hoff was getting from their center, #54’s face today and he is only a RS FR. Any of you daydreamers with a full proof crystal ball please loan it to Coach Wilson so he can see 5 months ahead of what is in front of him and keep you all happy. TR’s talent is wasted in Normal. I am sure he feels the same and I am also sure he will not say it. It is still FB season in my house. Oh, by the way without Wilson as HC today the score would have been worse as the 1st half would have been just as the 2nd half was and that has a little to do with how I measure coaching.

  19. All I know is that the two offensive plays that I would call innovative gained good yardage. The reverse and the pulling guard play. Everything else was straight up the gut, smash mouth football. We have no movement, no misdirection and this coach is supposed to be offensively innovative? You can argue that it’s the talent, but this is coach Wilson’s fourth year and he is responsible.

  20. …his 4th year, correct…how many games for the QB?…smash mouth FB will get them through the rest of the season…

  21. all this Sunday morning quarterbacking…..all i have to say is coach Kevin Wilson is doing a wonderful job and building a great program, give him a 8 year contract extension he has earned it!! Yes, he got blindsided by Tre Roberson, but he blindsided the whole team….If Tre Roberson had of announce he was leaving first Cam Coffman would still be at IU….enough of second guessing!!! for all you know it all out there, we now know why Chris Covington was the second string quarterback (bigger, stronger), coach Wilson advised us that Chris was the better option. This team and every Coach Wilson team fought very hard today until the game had taking its toll. Everyone forget that MSU is rated number 5 in national polls and projected by Vegas experts to go to the college playoff. as i said before I believe in Coach Wilson and i believe in the program he is building. we have come to far to turn back now!! If you look at the talent level on the field you have to admit IU FOOTBALL has come a very long way. keep it going coach Wilson.

  22. I’m sorry to disagree, but in most professions, if you aren’t making the grade by the fourth year, you’re gone. I think four years is generous. I think the alarm bells should be going off in the AD’s head considering how the fans were streaming out of the stadium after halftime.

  23. No way Wilson will be gone after this year, and no way Wilson will get eight years if he does not deliver a winning season soon. I’m guessing that Glass will assess him after next year. What is Wilson’s record? How good is the recruiting (improving or on decline)? What is the team’s morale? What is home game attendance (increasing or declining)? And most of all, are IU’s boosters happy and donating money, or are they upset and withholding their cash? As for statements like, “Kw is the best option IU has,” and “It would be insane to undue everything he (Wilson) has done;” those comments just don’t make any sense. There are other good coaches out there. Who’s to say that they could not do better than Wilson or improve IU football’s performance at a faster rate? And as for ‘undoing everything that he has done,” what exactly has Wilson done? You measure the success of a football program by variables including wins vs losses, graduation rates, and players not showing up on police reports. Half way through his fourth season, Wilson’s record is really no better than his predecessors and not on par with Mallory. We can all be optimistic that Wilson has IU on the right trajectory, even if this season implodes due to the QB situation, but in the end, his performance must be evaluated by the same criteria that any other IU coach is judged on. And given the financial stakes involved, Wilson’s performance is even more important to IU Athletic’s financial future than all other varsity athletic coaches. He may get five years, he may get six, but if he doesn’t produce a winning season after either of those two seasons, it will be very hard to justify giving Wilson more time. I hope 2015 is a great success for Wilson and IU football. In the mean time, I hope Glass stops scheduling top ten teams for IU’s homecoming game. Are we playing Ohio State in the 2015 homecoming game? That was demoralizing.

  24. I know Tsao don’t like people comparing coaches but I just don’t understand when you say: “What has Wilson done?” Come on Podunker. Under his watch we’re getting the best recruits I’ve seen ever in 33 years. The program has momentum on its side. Do you really want to go back to the Lynch days and unravel everything that has been done? It’s a one player at a time philosify. It’s going to take time to right this program. THATS WHY WILSON WAS SIGNED TO 8 YEARS. Glass knew the program was a derailment.

    The contract hoopla is debatable, but thankfully you’re not like TJ in Texas who basically easily gives up and wants to burn the mother down to ashes. I’m not pissed at you or anything. You know as well as I do that this program has struggled for years. I keep hanging on. Firing coaches because of personal disgruntlement isn’t the answer. Let the man fulfil his contract. If the program is still a stuggle than fire his ass.

  25. Been following iu football since the mid 1950’s. With the exception of a handful of seasons this is iu football. Defense is so bad that offense becomes over rated and not just this year but other years as well. Iu always has a few, couple or even handful of good players but they to get over rated because they stand out when compared to rest of team. Qb situation a year ago. ..many teams have a two or three stable of qb’s as good as or better than iu had. Martinsville Qb Mr football In Indiana set on the bench his whole iu career. ND and fsu look so confident because of their talent. Those players have skills and demonstrate them against one another at a super high level. Iu has trouble or cannot demonstrate skllls at that level against mac teams. Yes ND and FSU have excellent coaches.

  26. That’s the most sensible comment I’ve read by you Ben. That’s basically all I’m saying. If he is the man we’ve selected to lead, I do believe it is our obligation to support him for that period and not try to shake the rug out-from-under-him. I think to this point Kevin Wilson has identified the areas that need attention beginning with the talent. I don’t think there’s much of a question how much it has improved. But some 20 of the first level players are freshmen, red shirt freshmen and sophomores. At one time the B1G used to separate players by sponsoring competition through B1G Freshman team and a JV program. They recognized the difference that existts in the physical development.

    In two years we will be asked “where in the heck did these players come from?’ We have good, strong talent on campus and they will be competitive as they mature…we have to give them that chance by allowing them the time to mature, patiently. Frustrated fans demanding they play beyond their physical limits is not only crazy it si counterproductive. They are who they are: good, young solid ball players, most of whom were attending their high school senior dance six months ago. And, the screaming we are hearing “I’ve waited 20 years and I want to win now”, shows not only immaturity but it betrays how little those who scream it know about football. You are right, fans should think for a second and not blame it on Wilson…blame it on the coaches and administrators who allowed the program to get so flimsy it requires 4-6 years to dig it out. In fact, they should also blame it on themselves…they allowed the poor coaching and administrating to let it get to this point.

    You (in the broad sense) get what you put into it. Right now we should be supporting every step made by Wilson and staff right through the full term of the contract and do our arguing only at that point. That’s been my consistent and constant message and it continues to be so.

  27. To whom it may concern- Your clamoring, constant undermining of the direction of the football programs and your rants regarding how it is presently being managed are not only dangerous but are the type of reactive thinking that has put the football program on constant artificial respiration to begin with. Since Mallory no coach has lasted more than four years; and the continuous rotation of search, new coach and firings are, directly, the cause of our failure. Any individual who has ever worked at a successful organization will tell you that stability and continuity are the two most important factors in the organization’s success. I worked and was at the very top level of management of one such organization (for more than ten years, until I retired) and can tell you, without any hesitation, that our criteria for good management (35,000 employees, a 5+ Billion $ Budget) when we were reviewing its performance was exactly that stability, the predictability of policy making and the reliability on outcomes were principal goals/objectives.

    And, when we searched for new people in different new, expanding areas or when we made changes in existing areas, their ability to show continuity and stability told us a lot more about their performance than any short-range fluctuations, positive or negative in incomes.

    That, for me, is the basis for looking at the reform of the football program at Indiana. When IU administration looked to the problematic of changing the negative direction of the program, those in charge made some key decisions that led them to choose chose Kevin Wilson. Some were philosophical in nature. Bringing Wilson meant we accepted the idea that we would approach the B1G from the standpoint of offensive football in a conference dominated by defensive powers. We delegated the strategic choices to Wilson to begin his reconstruction of the program and he has done so successfully implementing his vision during the second and third year of his tenure. (Since he was hired in December, the first year was determined to be a year of adaptation and a wash from the stand point of competition). We also mandated that, as circumstances demanded and permitted , we address the structural and conceptual problems that were manifested in the defensive failures of the last 20 years and start that reconstruction from scratch. Wilson did so, at the end of year three of his tenure, when he searched for and brought in Coach Knorr. This year, 2014, was the first year of Knorr’s implementation of his defensive schemes and management. So far this year there has been some evidence of improvement, especially in the area of identifying specifically weak areas. Some specific areas (defensive line play) already show a significant jump from previous years. Yes, there is still lots of room to continue improving.

    So, obviously, if you look at it with an analytical and studious eye, we are where we should be at year four. We are substantially better offensively- an undeniable fact when you look at the results. Even if we consider the impact of the unfortunate loss of our leader and first three qb’s, we would be stupid to allow these short term complications interfere with the progression of the reconstruction of a previously failing football program.

    We fans, are not professionals. We (you and I; and JPat’s and others who claim as if they were) have no history in the development of a top college level football program; nor have we been educated to do so; nor do we have the experience of dealing with the many issues coaching staff must deal with. But, as IU football fans, we do have and, or must assume the experience our history as losers in football, Podunker. That experience alone should tell us that we should walk away from trying to manage the football program, stop usurping its leaders and leave it in the hands of the professionals hired and empowered to do so. Were this a corporation I managed and influenced from the top, that is exactly the mandate I would give those trying to push their weight around but not directly responsible for the program: shut-up, walk away, be supportive and allow time and space for the real pros to do their work. We’ll come back to that review during the last half of the seventh year of their full seven year contract. Period.

    It’s time we handle this like serious, grown-up, responsible people of an organization we care about and are determined to see succeed. Not by the tantrum of a 7-year-old.

  28. Didn’t Grossman go to FSU? And didn’t Hook’s dad play for IU? I blame loyalty….I blame the “me” world. They sing of cream and crimson in their backyards, but we’re never good enough for their own living room trophies….They got their shots on Indiana h.s. fields and stadiums, but most have no real lasting love for the alma mater…

    Jordy Hulls….Hoosiers like Jordan are far and few between.. Did you see that young man cry his eyes out at senior night? We fired a Mallory…I’m not sure if we honor much of anything anymore…..I know it’s IU football and everyone wants to win..But, damn it all, sometimes you just have to lock your hearts and arms together and never throw a fellow Hoosier overboard. You have to give a man that loves the place a fair chance…There are plenty that love the backyards of Bloomington while they built their names amongst the loyal and sports-crazed fans of Indiana….There are parents that once played for a basketball or football team wearing the cream and crimson….Scott May’s son…? …Harangody(IU football player) whose son became Big East Player of the Year for ND basketball

    Piss on all of them instead of pissing on Wilson….and IU football. We’re not good enough for their own kids…Every pass that MSU QB completed could have been a Memorial resurrection….We have the athletes…We just don’t have many Jordy Hulls….or Cody Zellers. We just don’t see anyone following in the footsteps of the few that love Indiana more than their sure thing reflection…

    Loyalty….? There is none. Professed love for cream and crimson is empty blow…Put up, or shut up…We educate and cheer these young men on in high school…We put uniforms on the backs of parents and now they want their kids to be a star elsewhere…? We fire the son of a coach that believed with all his heart in IU? It’s a “me” world, folks….And when you’re in need of your big pot of gold to fill your “me” world, why on earth do you care about those meaningless fans that once cheered you on…or cheered your father on? It’s about me…It’s not about making something from nothing.

  29. We fired Bobby Knight….Conclusion:….? We’re stupid hillbillies and corn growers that let the Establishment infect our minds into making us believe we should crucify ourselves for being great at something other than growing corn. Oh…oh…the shame…Oh, terrible Bobby…oh, terrible Kelvin….oh, terrible Mallory….oh, terrible puritanical bullsh__t…..!!! Hoosiers need to quit sucking on the Establishment blanket….Get rid of Crean before Knight passes off into the good night….Bring back those kids we labeled as thugs….Give them a lifetime Bill of Rights to get an IU education….Stop with whining on how we’ve ignored football and how our great past in basketball should no longer be embraced because we had a coach that grabbed a spoiled frat rat’s arm and raised his voice a few thousand times…! Did I mention that he used the eff word repeatedly? Did I mention that he didn’t speak of prayers? Did I mention that he didn’t tweet Jesus four times a day? Did I mention Dustin Dopirak is now smirking while covering Tennessee football? Did I mention we often appear to turn out more highly talented b-ball players in this state than football players? Am I allowed to say that without being crucified? Did I mention :”put up, or shut up” to the few really talented h.s. football players in this state that don’t want to risk their personal glory on Hoosier football? Bring back Bobby…..Piss on all these pompous and perfect righteous a-holes that have crucified us and hated on us for nothing……Quit chasing and putting under microscope all the tiny drops of a morning crap from relatively very good men that gave it their best at IU….

    Get off the righteous pedestal used to beat up on your own…..and deny your own….Most deny to embrace because they’re not half the man most that built anything in that little ass town in southern Indiana….And that includes many a losing football coach to go along with the one or two hoops coaches that hung banners.

  30. We fans, are not professionals.

    Exactly….and nor does any opinion have any more weight by the addition of ego poundage(like needless fat on a slow and nonathletic lineman) because of something any so-called football expert would like to sell and market as so-called “success” in their own current or past “professional” world.

    Managers always look brilliant when they have talented workers six rungs down the hierarchy of their own ego-fattening headlines….

    Coaches always look brilliant when they have talented players six seats down the bench of the hierarchy the wind they blow at podiums…..

    Knight lost touch on how the great athletes and fans of Indiana contributed to his own success…Greatness in basketball teams and in corporations isn’t always trickle down economics/success….? Talent, tradition, and hard work gives quite a big push upward from roots for those making home and basking in the upper branches of the sun. Easy to suck the life out of the earth without feeding back any of the sun….But those that do, will eventually cut the life off the whole tree.

  31. Finally answering my own question here(not that it matters all that much), but Grossman played for Florida…and not FSU as I stated with the uncertainty of a question mark in post #32. It just goes to show how success at the college level(Grossman went 1st round) and a huge arm doesn’t predict a thing in determining NFL legendary status….He became more known for frightening inconsistency than anything else….Pretty sure he was likely viewed as the “prototype” destined for the Hall of Fame. How many times was Tom Brady passed up in the draft? ..Wasn’t Walter Peyton considered to be too small to ever amount to much as an NFL running back? .As Tsao said, leave this stuff to the professionals…..

    His twenty interceptions in one season are among the most thrown by any Bears’ quarterback in almost two decades. The unusual combination ranked Grossman as statistically the most inconsistent quarterback in almost a decade in 2006(courtesy: Wikipedia)

    A 2006 graph illustrating Grossman’s per game quarterback rating could be easily found to have eerie similarity to the drastic emotional movement of giant “highs” to lowest of “lows” in the average IU football fan blogging on Scoop.

  32. All the talk last week was about the offense and who the QB would be. The 800 pound gorilla in the room is the defense. When you give up 45,37,45, and 56 points it doesn’t matter how good your offense is or if you coach is some offensive guru, you still lose.

  33. When you can’t keep the offense on the field(time of possession) through some sustained drives(even if they don’t always result in 7 points), It’s going to wear the hell out of your defense….And compounding that attrition with young players, new systems/schemes, and limits to slowly improving skill and size within our overall depth, certainly poses even more challenges to a defense repeatedly being called into duty….

    We lost some very talented players at the receiver position…..We lost some deep threats. We have a great running back, but we rarely balance some of his explosive big gainers with series that can also offer a contrast to grind-it- out yardage….When we do put up points, it’s often the result of long runs with little chewing up of the clock….Back on the field comes the defense.. And now we’ve been forced to go with 3rd and 4th string QBs because of injuries….How do you keep an offense on the field if we can’t compliment some of the explosiveness of Coleman with a decent passing game…and some movement of the chains that doesn’t simply rely on the big play?

    A top QB could have likely put some band-aids on the offense that took a bit of an intermittent hit by losing NFL level receiver talent….Sudfeld had enough experience and arm to bring the new talent along and gobble up some clock in the process by spreading the wealth a solid run game balanced with adequate passing game…That is now out the door as we dip into a very pressed and undersized freshman QB and a walk-on QB.

    No matter how much of an offensive “guru” Wilson may be, fate has dealt an ugly hand this year….We’re basically down to one or two big play-makers and an offense that just doesn’t have the ability(even if we burden Coleman with way too many carries) and proper mix of talent to sustain drives….The result is a declining ‘time of possession’ situation asking way too much of any defense…(Saturday Possession Time………….MSU 39:24 IU 20:36).

    More than one 800 pound gorilla in the room. Coleman, or no Coleman, the challenges to replace Sudfeld and key components of last season’s dynamic offense has a lot to do with a very improved defense looking on paper as the same old product..

  34. Ben, I’ve been an ardent fan of IU football since I watched my first college football game in Memorial Stadium in 1965. That was a bad year, but it did not deter me or diminish my interest. I was absolutely hooked on IU football when John Pont coached IU to the Rose Bowl. Yes, it appears Wilson is getting better recruits than his predecessor, but it should be noted that Tre Roberson and last year’s best wide receivers were recruited under Lynch. Sudfeld was recruited by IU’s previous Offensive Coordinator who was with Arizona when the relationship began, but that coach left IU for North Carolina after last season. If the trajectory of Wilson’s recruiting continues to incline, I believe Wilson will produce a winning season, either next year or this year, and then he should be rewarded with a raise and contract extension. But a season like the one we’re in the midst of now can change that trajectory in a hurry. Everything is relative to expectations, and since fans and potential recruits expected to see IU football improve this year, and it really has not, the psychological and emotional affect on fans and recruits can be disappointment to the degree that all of the old narratives about IU football are revived. You’re already seeing evidence of that affect right here in The Hoosier Scoop! So, if IU is perceived as a program on the rise, a greater number of better athletes (in relative terms) will sign LOIs to play for IU. If the perception is that IU football is not getting better, the athletes IU covets and needs will go elsewhere and some young men previously committed to IU will sign with other teams. And if that begins to happen, IU football’s trajectory will decline. Yes, it takes time (and money) to build a program from virtually nothing to a winning program. But it also takes fan support, fan excitement and energy. That’s currently being threatened right now. Most fans don’t sit around and analyze the circumstances of Wilson’s tenure. They just want to know, “is our team winning or losing?” Yes, Wilson deserves more time. But how much more time? How long does IU’s administration tolerate losing seasons, half empty stadiums and blowouts on nationally televised games before it feels the need to make a change? After six years, if a head coach has not produced a winning season, or at least a six and six season, it’s hard to justify giving him more time, regardless of the condition the program he inherited was in when he was hired. At that point, it’s not credible to argue that there are no other coaches out there that couldn’t do a better job or achieve greater success. I hope all this becomes a mute point after next season. I’d really like to see Wilson lead IU to a bowl game in 2015, and then get a big, fat raise and contract extension. But if IU does not produce a winning season, or at least a six and six season next year, Wilson and Glass will be under enormous pressure, and rightfully so. IU has invested heavily (again, in relative terms) to turn the football program around. It has a right to expect the returns on that investment to begin coming in. There are coaches out there that can make that happen, but I hope Wilson derives the rewards for all the effort he has made to transform IU football.

  35. “You (in the broad sense) get what you put into it. Right now we should be supporting every step made by Wilson and staff right through the full term of the contract and do our arguing only at that point. That’s been my consistent and constant message and it continues to be so.”

    Being or having a lame duck coach is not an acceptable option, for either the coaching staff or the University. I agree that we IU fans should support Wilson for the next two seasons and remain optimistic, but Glass can’t and won’t allow Wilson to coach as a lame duck in the seventh year of his contract. That would be suicide for Glass as an AD and very destructive for IU football. Glass will either reward Wilson for success by extending his contract, or IU will buy out the last year of Wilson’s contract and hire another coach (just like they did with Lynch). If you’re a college AD or GM in the pros, you understand that the last year of a contract is basically the coach’s severance package or basis for negotiations for a new contract. It simply governs the transition process in an orderly manner. Having or being a lame duck coach is toxic to the future of the team and program. I don’t believe Wilson would tolerate it and I don’t believe a smart man like Glass would ever allow it to come to that.

  36. I’m guessing had the offense just gobbled up a little more time against Bowling Green, Maryland and Iowa the defense would have been more rested and would not have given up all those points. By the way who was Indiana’s QB for those games.?

  37. I wouldn’t worry too much bout CKW’s future at IU. Wilson’s tenure is a double edged sword. If by year 7, we are not in a bowl, he’s gone and we get to start this process over again…wonderful :(. If he succeeds, he will likely be recruited away by another school looking for a turnaround guy and we won’t have the bucks to keep him. Of course, the latter is conditioned on the degree of success….an invite to a minor bowl is one thing but if we get to as New Years Day bowl, he’s likely gone.

  38. Rich Rod’s total package at Arizona is just a little higher than what IU pays Wilson. Rich Rod got fired by Michigan, collected a multi-million dollar severance, spent a year working for the network, then got the Arizona job. He’s directed Arizona, which was a five win team the year before he got to Tucson, to consecutive bowl victories and now has AZ ranked in the top 20, and competing for the Pac 12 Championship. He was one (of three) missed field goal away from beating USC last week and being ranked in the top five. His AZ teams have beaten Oregon two years in a row, once in Tucson (a blowout victory) and a convincing win this year at Oregon.

    One school’s bum (Michigan ran him out of town) is another school’s (AZ) savior. And now, RichRod and AZ are laughing all the way to the bank while Michigan stews in its own sweat and tears. After this year, AZ will either give RichRod a huge raise and extend his contract, or they will be at risk of losing him. My guess is that AZ will elect to keep RichRod with a package at about $3.5 M per year with a five year extension. And for the record, when RichRod arrived in Tucson, his team played in some of the oldest and worst football facilities in the country. Now, AZ’s football facilities are on par with with any school in the country with maybe the exception of Oregon and/or Bama.

    Football programs can be transformed from a losing trajectory into a winning program in a short amount of time (less than four years). Let’s hope Wilson can get it done next year or the year after that. If not, there just might be another RichRod out there looking for redemption.

  39. RAM-

    Knorr is in his first year….I wasn’t one that necessarily believed that was a fix-all. It relieved some breaking in the ranks and created more long term confidence, but it also created an entire defense to fall behind a learning curve again.. I’ve not played football in an environment that approaches college football….I’m not sure how many on here could say they have real knowledge of how much a college player must invest in preparation and repetition in learning a defense….Add to that equation a defense still strained to catch up to the level of talent and depth found in an upper tier Big 10 football program(maybe even a middle tier…e.g. Minnesota, Iowa, Maryland).

    Throw into that equation an offense that doesn’t have the level of talent in the receiving crew it had last year…Understood, we had Sudfeld early, but I don’t think we could honestly say the offense was clicking on the same cylinders as last year….Not taking anything away from Coleman, but we need more weapons and we need to compliment some of those explosive runs with some timely sustained drives that can shorten the game….

    We did put almost all the eggs in one basket…We took a risk that an offensive “guru” could recruit and retain enough dynamic talent to make a fast-paced/.change-of-pace, potentially explosive, methodical when need be, offense the immediate constant to build excitement into the program.. The ability to put points on the board and outscore opponents was intended to be the draw(fans and recruits)until the defense could catch up to speed…Main Point: Make the program exciting….Have the potential to steal some games while the product evolves….Keep, even top defenses in our conference on their heals….

    I see the defense as a gaping hole in the boat…Rather than sit 30 miles offshore and slowly bail, we decided to race to shore with Wilson’s high-powered motor ….And maybe, by speeding to shore, we’d raise up the hull enough above the waterline to possibly get close enough to swim home. Keep in mind, sharks are constantly circling around the boat and we have passengers that are already very weak…..The first boards over the hole in hull were replaced(Mallory) due to water rushing in faster than expected….and more panic.. The Wilson outboard has a couple cylinders failing(loss of dynamic NFL receiver, run-option QB, and injury to what was initially intended to be a 4th string QB) ….and the remaining functioning pistons are overworked are only hope(Coleman)….But, at the end of the day, it was our only shot for survival. …One big Wilson outboard on a very suspect boat with a defensive hull in dire need of rebuild…

  40. oops….[transfer] of run-option QB(one of our failing cylinders of the Wilson outboard)…

  41. Rich Rod is a good example to site. Rich Rod was also the guy who taught HCKW the spread up-tempo offense that HCKW gets credit for today. HCKW and his mentor Randy Walker asked Rich Rod to help them when they were at NW. They spent a week or two with Rich Rod learning his system and implementing it. Rich Rod was even quoted in an interview – that back in 2000 when NW upset Michigan ( using the system ) that he was watching on TV and that NW didn’t even bother to change the sideline signals or terminology. He and his coaches and players could read every play call NW made. So – Rich Rod changed all the signals for his own team from there on out.

    He was on of the first guys to go up-tempo and use spread formations to be able to run the ball. HCKW’s offense in primarily a straight take away from Rich Rod’s – with some Mark Mangino and Chuck Long mixed in.

  42. Arizona has a nice warm climate……Haven’t we talked about “climate”:(as in cold winter temps not being a real draw for some recruits?)on here before….No surrounding exciting city near Bloomington…..Cold weather for a good majority of the academic year…Not the most diverse setting for some people…..It’s a tough sell to big numbers of recruits even if things were stable or on the upswing….And then we have those powerhouse programs with tradition that will always be a thorn….It is a tough sell, indeed.. Those that think it’s merely going to be quickly fixed by bringing in a very expensive coach are just as delusional….Different environment…different history….different weather….different exposure…way different exposure in terms of being noticed for your talent(Coleman is an obvious example)…..Let’s please quit pretending that what can work elsewhere easily transfers to a Bloomington tucked in the limestone hills of southern Indiana.

    It’s completely amazing that b-ball worked…even within the setting of a very rich state with a rich history in the high school game.

  43. Harvard…. You don’t need to hire expensive coaches or coordinators. It’s like buying a mutual fund. They need to have a solid history and a proven track record. (on both sides of the ball)

  44. H4H:

    You can make excuses for the lack of appeal of Bloomington for some. However – Manhattan, KS ( KSU ) – Starksville MS ( Miss. St. ) – Oxford, MS ( Ole Miss ) – Waco, TX ( Baylor ) – Madison, WI ( Wisc.) – Tuscaloosa, AL ( Bama ) and I could go on – are not exactly locations that top recruits would seek out for each towns various charms.

    Win – and they (recruits ) will come. If warmth and city atmosphere were prominent in recruits thought process than Hawaii and UNLV would be ranked #1 and #2 in the nation every year.

    Kids want only to win – go to bowl games – play on TV- have a chance to get to the NFL and most importantly – have a ton of attractive girls on campus to chose from.

    IU can supply the TV – the NFL and the girls. The winning is the missing piece. But rest assured – Bloomington’s location has nothing to do with that problem.

  45. It’s location + weather + diversity + historical winning/ losing + perceived risk + talent already in place + stability in coaching staff + sustained crowds/excitement in stands + prime time television exposure(not just any exposure)…..

    I love my alma mater, but I think recruits take a far more intense look at a school…..It’s definitely analogous to a portfolio…And IU’s portfolio is not balanced with stable performers and stable coaching staffs to counter the enormous risk on so many uncertain investments. Can on big time coach change such volatility in a fan base and nervous recruits at key positions that will not sit and wait for things to get quickly better?

    Most of those programs you listed have, at minimum, a base of tradition and some noteworthy history….We have one Rose Bowl and a Holiday Bowl in 40 years….? Forgive me if it sounds like a daunting task to accomplish in a town tucked in limestone hills about 15 miles south of what was once the Midwest gathering hole for the for the nation’s top racist organization.

    Bloomington once felt like a progressive place…Hiring self-promoters and ultra-conservative preachers of righteousness doesn’t give much of a sense of rising diversity and a vibrant community…..In my humble opinion, Wilson is a breath of fresh air…..I do believe many want to run him out of town…..and it has nothing to do with football.

  46. Charlie Strong inherited a team that just won 15 games in 3 seasons at the University of Louisville. Under Coach Strong, the Cards posted a record of 25-14 with 2 bowls wins and a pair of Big East titles in 3 years and you guys are willing to give Coach Wilson seven or eight years to get to the Music City Bowl?

  47. Murfman, I shall expand on your line of thought with more facts than you know even though you won’t agree with it as it will not fit your narrative. L’ville FB has earned and enjoyed much success over the course of the past 100 years. In my time I remember the success they had with Johnny U as their QB in the 50’s. Of course Howard Schellenberger put them on the CFB map. Lee Corso , remember him, had very good success in the Ville. He left there and essentially fell flat on his face with 2 winning seasons in 10 years at IU immediately following. U of L has funded their FB program well for decades even before AD Jurich took charge. In fact the University support for the FB program has been so good for so long “idiots” like John L Smith and Bobby P had success thereand now BP again. Steve Kragthorpe was a good recruiter but did not get the W/L of coaches before him but absolutely did not leave the kitchen bare for Strong. In fact Charlie found it pertty cushy when he got to L’ville and Jurich stated high powering the sports programs. Lots more cash in the Ville than Bloomington and it is all dedicated to the Cards. Strong is a good coach no doubt but the FB mountain at IU is much bigger than ole Chuck has ever had to face. So yes Coach Wilson will need the full term of his contract which means he will have to have an extension to complete that mission of stringing together consecutive successful seasons.

  48. KSU The team’s next bowl game came in 1993, when Kansas State began a streak of eleven straight bowl appearances under coach Bill Snyder that lasted through the 2003 season. This is the 20th-longest bowl streak in college football history

    MISS. ST. Bowl Appearances* 1911, 1936, 1940, 1963, 1974, 1980, 1981, 1991, 1992, 1994, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2007, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013

    OLE MISS 10-2 Bowl Record since 1992…….and home of William Faulkner!

    A lot of football tradition in Kansas, Mississippi, Oklahoma, Alabama….

    The job of turning IU Football into a legit and consistently competitive program within the Big 10 is without compare….There is no tradition. There are blips on the radar, but it’s basically a program that has nothing to ever look back on but ridicule. I know this isn’t what some want to hear, but it’s a great place for any coach to make a ton of money and expectations will always be qualified because of the historic wasteland that became Memorial. You don’t take a job at Indiana football and stand at a podium and convince your peers its been your career dream to coach in Bloomington…”Because it’s Indiana Football”….??

    The stage of the Big 10 and membership in the conference is the ONLY lure for quality coaches and quality recruits…If the Big 10 schools were all part of a football portfolio of investments, IU Football would have been sold off as the loser stock decades ago….

    Fans don’t stay in the seats….Basketball hype and discussions throughout the campus is the usual antidepressant relied upon and consumed by late October….It’s that bad…And, yes, it’s been that bad for decades.

    To come from a program like Oklahoma to coach Indiana football? It’s either simple greed for a big payout while you milk fans along with false hope….or you’re just absolutely insane…..or you’re on a death wish….or you’re running from a stalker mistress, or…….(here comes the 1/1,000,000,000,000,000 possibility) somehow you bring winning football to Bloomington, make gold out of the football septic hole of the Big 10, steal Tom Crean’s chastity belt, and become the greatest coach to ever.win at a .550 win percentage.

  49. And did I mention one of the top football programs in the nation is 3 hours to the north and somehow, amazingly, within the borders of Indiana? Did I mention the Golden Dome…? Ever hear of it? Did I mention Knute Rockne….? The Four Horseman…? George “The Gipper” Gipp? Win one for the Gipper..? Do you think college football fans from anywhere north of Purdon’t in Lafayette up to the southern shores of Lake Michigan….and into the streets of Chicago….are talking Hoosier Football? Or, do you think they’re talking Irish Football right this moment?

    Let’s not crap on Indiana too excessively….Let’s not belittle Indiana Football to the extent that we forget or ignore just how special this tiny state is in the world of sports….There’s are storied high school basketball…Gene Hackman…Milan….The Big O)….Bird….There’s that Stevens guy at Butler that put hoops back on the map for Indiana….Didn’t they made back-to-back Championship games and back-to-back Final Fours in b-ball.? Isn’t that Brad guy now coaching one of the most storied NBA teams in history…..? And then there’s that damn dome school again…..ND is always going to be recognized as one of the most storied football programs in the nation…And then we have that “bury me face down” guy…What’s his name? Was it that Bob Knight guy that put limestone hills on the map…..and taught that kid coaching at UCLA how to comb his brillo do? How many coaches are known throughout the world by simply saying their first name.>>? Bobby. Nuff said. And it’s enough to make us feel pretty good 30 years after the fact about those banners Crean can do his Cirque du Soleil act from….

    But back to Bloomington…. So many difficult decisions for a top prospect…”.Hmm? Should I visit ND…..Badgers…? ….Michigan….? .MSU…? Nah…I hear there’s a football coach in Bloomington that’s going to turn IU into a powerhouse program in three years….I’m going to IU….I’m going to get noticed.”

    Allow Wilson to be delusional…..Give him the benefit of the doubt where doubt was invented and grew from a single dingleberry in Podunker’s shorts born from Canyon Doubt…There is no other sane man(let alone a hot commodity head coach) that would touch IU Football with a 10 ft. pole…

  50. I gotta say, and gotta admit, that post #58 was very impressive….Clarion knows his high school and college football. Knows it a hell of a lot more than me….I can throw out a lucky prediction now and then…But Hoosier Clarion brings some real legitimacy, knowledge, and experience to a football discussion…. It doesn’t come courtesy of Wikipedia….It comes from a history of intense following of the sport…..If I’m going to weight the opinions on Wislon, I think I’m going to start leaning toward the side of the fence this Clarion guy places his vote…I don’t see journalists on this site that know football inside and out like Clarion…..Lucky to have him here to balance those that just fake it with the internet and create their own low pressure systems of negativity…..

    Clarion has never liked Harvard….Another plus in his corner.

  51. H4H!

    Between you and I I’ll interject some personal thoughts concerning you and me right quick. Of all the posters who write on this board(and 2-3 others I frequent)you are hands down the sharpest mind. Now I’ll shove that compliment down your throat by saying you waste your sharpness in not using it to focus on a goal that would really benefit YOU. You strike me as someone who is so sharp you become more thoughts than action. But you do as you see fit. If you were under my wing and in my employ I’d grind you to dust then show you how to redirect and build yourself into something that other people would have to keep their eye on. But it is none of my business and I’ve said more than I should, forgive me just a little for being way out of bounds. You and I could be friendlier even though you waste the energy I covet and find myself slowly running out of. Nuff sed!

    As far as you stating Wilson being the right guy using my evaluation, you and I will only be right if he is given the needed time to accomplish the plan he has set out to use.

  52. A few comments in response to some of the posts above:
    1. Crimson’s #51 and #54 were excellent posts. Thanks for the history on Rich Rod, and your logic is spot on.
    2. RAM’s post #53 is also excellent, and proves that he understands.
    3. Tucson is a dump, and it is no where near as nice a college town as Bloomington. The temperature in August and September, when the students return to campus, is often 110 to 115 degrees during the day. At night, it drops down to a cool 93! A lot of football players, especially the BIG guys, are turned off by those temperatures. It’s so hot there in August, U of A football often relocate for their summer camps. U of A is a nice campus, but it does not compare to the beauty of IUB. Climate and campus appeal are not advantages over IU until about mid November.
    4. John Forbes Nash, Jr. had “hands down the sharpest mind” of just about anybody, but ……. Oh, never mind.

  53. Hoosier Clarion, your #58 is brilliant. A great response, factual and thought out. Like all of your posts it is to the point and is a great lesson on focus, brevity, the value of synthesis and avoiding conflict while being direct. In many ways, a great comment which- among others- ought to give me pause.

    The same of your excellent and caring observation on HfH. You admire in him what I admire, his great intellect, his involvement and his critical spirit. In my case, I also enjoy his love of words and prose. You are a true friend to him; and through your comments and love for IU, to the rest of us. Thanks.

    And truly, I respect the heck out of you. Wished the Hoosiers had a hundred thousand fans like you. That would be success.

  54. Mr. Hoosier Clarion,

    Please don’t put words in my mouth with your pompous diatribe about U of L. So I’m not old enough to remember Johnny Unitas in a Cards uniform. Everything else was old news.

    I still can’t believe you guys would give this coach 7 or 8 years. I just see alarming signs that this guy wasn’t the right choice.

  55. Gosh…i give a rare and sincere compliment to Clarion and he thinks he can grind me to dust……Making dust does sound kinda fun…Maybe I need to become a wrecking ball operator….?….or become an expert at building demolition….? I do appreciate the compliments, but I’m not really very sharp….More stubborn than anything else.. I’ve always had a passion for fixing things…not computers or complex machines…I love to work with my hands(has it been two weeks since Double Down forgot how to do percentages?)…Repairing a broken chair brings a strange amount of satisfaction….If I’d had enough funds, I would have enjoyed home restoration….Unfortunately, I also find too much fault in the world and I’m far too negative….I’m a good listener but not much of a comfortable communicator….In all my love for fixing things, I ignore what needs fixed in the mirror….I had chances to take easy forks in the road and I took them….Always thinking there was plenty of time to meet the challenges I feared, I took the pathway that gets a person by.. And when I say “easy,” I don’t mean that I was not dedicated or not working my ass off…..Guilt has always been too much of the equation…..Seeking from others what they were unwilling to give back to me was also part of the wrong fork…..Nothing makes me more angry than seeing a senior citizen that is treated like a child or a child that is treated like tag-along property with no love investment….Maybe wanting to fix things and people that I thought deserved to believe in themselves…and feel loved has left me high and dry….In the process of doing so, I quit believing in me. So, go ahead and grind me to dust, Clarion…..Oddly, I think that I’m a magnetic dust and it will all just zap back together into the dysfunctional shape of a destiny I’ve yet to find much purpose…..

    Sometimes I wish I was Chet’s son…..I wish I was building that sailboat with him…My father did his best, but we just never built anything together….I was always part of everything he built. He didn’t have the heart to grind me to dust…or maybe he thought it was just not worth it….And now here I sit as rubble of disjointed parts searching for the missing parts…..always searching for the missing parts. Maybe my words can fix IU Football….Maybe I’m just a wrecking ball.

    You will know better than to give Harvard a backhanded compliment…..And why, oh why, did I open that door?
    Anyway, you really do know football, Clarion.

  56. What I would find interesting is what I never hear from the HT journalists….I’d like to know if they ever get chances to witness the chemistry(or, hopefully not, the lack of chemistry) between Wilson and his other coaches….

    Wilson has a great mind for the game…..He has a great love for the game.. But, as a fan, what I never get any look at is how he treats and involves the people around him….It may be the most critical aspect of this whole process. He’s always out front….He’s always the guy at the podium….He’s always the Hoosier face in front of the camera…I’m not sure if that’s the management style that’s going to get it done at IU…And, again, that’s not a criticism of Wilson….It’s just that I don’t have that view/window of what it looks like behind the scenes…in the locker room….So much can be assessed from simple observation…I sometimes get the sense that Wilson is too analytical …maybe too internal…I don’t have the benefit of being close enough to know if all the coaches mesh or it’s experts disjointed….

    It seems like such a complex mix to be a leader…..If the only requirement was having a great mind for the game, there would be thousands of great coaches….What I see in the two coaches that head up are two major sports, is an illusion….They act like head coaches…They command microphones and podiums very adequately….They have the gift of one-way gab ….They appear to be plenty capable to work as ESPN analysts….Tons of experience…Great players to hang their hats on….Association with programs that had/have great tradition…
    But does that make a great coach? Not many coaches can assemble a wining product even if granted all the winning separate parts…..Assembly is required…And few are rarely gifted to make everyone part of that assembly.

  57. I hate that statement that someone is a “great teacher.” How do we know? We’re not the one being taught.

    I’ve had the “great teachers’ I’ve thought later to not be so great…….The greatest reward as a student of anything is when you finally realize the teacher is is actually hooked on some unique quality you infected upon their own expertise….Teaching is far too called such when it’s simply a game of pitch rather than a game of catch.. Is Wilson willing to play a game of catch? Is he capable of making those around him feel as if he’s also infected by their passion? For all the criticism of Knight for being a dictator and tyrant, there had to be more to it…..Somehow, he must have been able to sincerely make his students feel they were giving back….He was benefiting more from what they were contributing than anything his brilliant mind could give to them….Why on earth would so many of his former players still feel such bonds to a “tyrant” if that wasn’t the case?

    Anyone agree with these thoughts…? Anyone want to grind it up into dust?

  58. Be ready to revise any system, scrap any method,abandon any theory, if success of the job requires it.

  59. Regarding Louisville…the University of Louisville has had the benefit of succeeding from what was one’s considered the city’s own failings. During the entire time referenced by Clarion’s history, the focus in Louisville has been to become a major sports market; logical in that the impetus has been that it already hosted one of the world’s top two or three sports event- the Kentucky Derby. But, alas, that one weekend was it, and after it was over…nothing.

    Worse yet, Louisville was forced to accept being in the shadow of its neighboring towns and rivals; to the east, Lexington, KY and the University of Kentucky; and, to the north, Indianapolis and its NFL and NBA teams and, 90 miles northwest, Indiana University and its Big Ten Hoosiers.

    Not that Louisville didn’t try. During the days of the ABA, its franchise, the Colonels was one of the mainstays of the ABA, the upstart league that forced the NBA into submission and merger. But, it cost Louisville the pro-basketball franchise. Louisville was forced to watch as Indianapolis (which had its own once-a-year event, the Indianapolis 500), joined its other major league neighbor, Cincinnati (NFL Bengals, MLB Reds) to create a major sports market becoming an NBA city with the Pacers and, shortly thereafter, reaching sports Nirvanna becoming a successful NFL city, literally ‘stealing’ (very important fact- it was not an expansion city) one of the most successful NFL teams in history…the Colts,from Baltimore in the middle of the night.

    For Louisville frustration continued and eventually the reality set in; Louisville- surrounded by three mid-size and two major sports-market areas (Chicago and Atlanta), would never be, beyond its Derby, a major professional sports town.

    In some ways, that realization, was turned into a blessing. Louisville’s business elite- an incredibly powerful and often social strata based hegemonic group, made an incredibly wise and intelligent choice. First it would accept reality; and, second, it would use it to its advantage. In the middle of downtown Louisville, not twenty blocks from where the state line that runs down the middle of the Ohio River separates the city from Indiana, is the campus of the University of Louisville. A large, academically mid-level metropolitan university largely attended by its mostly commuting students from the surrounding south shore Kentucky and north shore of the Ohio River south-central Indiana (New Albany, Jeffersonville, Corydon)resident.

    For Louisville’s elite; mostly the owners, executives and families of two of the most important industries in the US, the tobacco and hard liquor (whiskey, bourbon) industries – a sharp, traditional and in-touch with grass roots tastes group, Louisville’s disadvantage became an opportunity. Instead of pursuing professional franchises, the city threw its weight behind its local metropolitan state university, the University of Louisville, making it its quasi-professional sports attraction. The fact that the University of Indiana and the University of Kentucky used the city’s Freedom Hall for their interstate rivalry, helped.

    Outstanding coaching staffs were hired to throw the U of L into the national spotlight. Facilities were upgraded and new ones built, a sports arena and a major college football stadium, turning the University of Louisville into a major NCAA college power to satisfy the demand for big-time sports on both the Kentucky and Indiana side of the River.

    As Indianapolis was attracting and pushing the Pacers and he Colts as its major sports attractions and southern Ohio and Northern Kentucky threw their support behind the Cincinnati Bengals and the baseball Reds; Louisville focused its tremendous financial power in the growth of U. of Louisville basketball and now, its football team.

    Meanwhile Indiana University continued to sit in its much smaller pastoral college-town of Bloomington, with its central Indiana fan base, sharing its athletic market financial base between the Hoosiers and the Indianapolis football Colts and the basketball Pacers. It is not coincidental that a major four lane highway has linked Indianapolis and Louisville, for forty years; while only now is a four-lane super highway being built to replace the curvey and once old and dangerous two lane IND37 between Indianapolis and Bloomington. One could cover the 100 miles that separate Louisville from Indianapolis in about 90 minutes. For most of that time, on a football Saturday, the 48 miles connecting Bloomington with Indianapolis took about..an hour to an hour and a half. To this day, for about half of the Hoosiers football following in the northern half of the state of Indiana, the trek to Bloomington takes anywhere from 3-5 hours. Interestingly, the state of Indiana other public university, It’s worth noting that Purdue University faces similar geographical and transportation challenges.

    Louisville has a modern and major airport. Neither Indiana University’s Bloomington nor Purdue’s Lafayette do.

    The three weakest programs in the Big Ten are in three of the smallest four town/cities in the conference. Penn State, sitting in the middle of a football crazy state, is the only anomaly. Both Indiana and Purdue will have to, someday, consider playing part of their football schedules in Indianapolis to increase their attendance to the levels of other Big Ten universities such as Ohio State (Columbus), Michigan (Ann Arbor) Michigan State (East Lansing).

    Visionaries for Indiana University (and Purdue, as well) will have to emulate Louisville’s path. Consider and accept reality and, like Louisville’s elite, act accordingly.

  60. I completely agree with you Harvard. Knight’s teaching was predicated on you getting your ‘best’ out of you, not doing your best for him. A subtle (I think), but important difference. Good comment.

  61. “Wilson has a great mind for the game…” How do we know this to be true? None of us are in a position to evaluate Wilson’s ‘mind for the game.’ We’ve been told, by a friend from his High School, that he is a very smart man. He sounds likes he has a quick mind and is smart, but we don’t really know how smart he is, or if high intelligence has any impact on his ability to lead a team to a winning season.

    “He has a great love for the game…” How do we know that? How is one’s love for the game measured? Hell, a lot of people have a great love for the game, but few are qualified or worthy to be a head coach for a Big Ten team. A lot of failed college football coaches were smart people and had great love for the game, but that did not make them successful coaches. These statements are just meaningless.

    The bottom line is that Wilson has yet to prove he can win as a head coach. We should hold him to his own stated criteria, as he has demanded. I’m not knocking Wilson, just challenging some of these assumptions and the unfounded praise being tossed around. Intelligence and love for the game don’t necessarily equate to achieving success as a leader of the team. I really want Wilson to be successful as IU’s head coach. I like Wilson, and I especially like his offense. Sudfeld’s injury notwithstanding, I think the team has made progress this year and has a positive trajectory next year. I think Knorr was a good hire and a major upgrade over Mallory. I think IU’s conditioning, training and nutritional programs are outstanding, and Wilson deserves credit for bringing that to IU football. Wilson recruits good young men, and I give him credit for demanding they stay out of trouble and achieve academically too. But the jury is still out on Wilson as a head coach, and troubling questions remain. How come he keeps losing top assistants? An unstable coaching staff is not conducive to winning. How come it took him so long to dump Mallory when his defense was obviously terrible and not showing signs of improvement? How come Wilson’s teams lose all the close games? Let’s be careful we don’t put Wilson on a pedestal, because if he does not achieve the success we all hope for, a lot of support for IU football will fall with him if he ever gets fired. (And no, that is not a stealth attack, so don’t put words in my mouth.)

    If I’m Glass, I’m giving Wilson my full support and confidence for two more seasons (2015 and 2016) to lead IU to a winning season. If he does, I give him a big, fat raise and extend his contract. If he does not, I thank him for his effort, pay him his $500,000 severance, and find another man to lead IU football.

  62. “Intelligence and love for the game don’t necessarily equate to achieving success as a leader of the team…”

    Great quote…You, obviously, decided to pick my statements(a certain set of “meaningless” assumptions we’ll hope comes with any hire as important as a head coach based on history and others that have believed and retained Wilson) and didn’t bother to read on…Big surprise for an arrogant person that only wants to dictate an opinion rather than truly take the time to read thoroughly, absorb, understand another.

    The irony in your declaration of a meaningless label a statement about Wilson’s “love” and “intelligence” being impossible for any fan to truly measure, is that I was working my way from those statements(irregardless how much of the opinion is rooted in fact or fiction)to a similar conclusion your holding up as a trophy of your own giant light bulb going off….

    My follow-up statements(basically intended to rebuke my own thoughts about “love” for the game and :”intelligence” for the game …and if you really bother to digest all of post #70 you could add in the possibly irrelevant public speaking ability and salesmanship…..The quotes below were those basic internal debates with the premise of intelligence and love for the game still needing something else that translates into leadership….

    “Wilson has a great mind for the game…..He has a great love for the game.. But, as a fan, what I never get any look at is how he treats and involves the people around him….It may be the most critical aspect of this whole process. “

    “It seems like such a complex mix to be a leader…..If the only requirement was having a great mind for the game, there would be thousands of great coaches…”

    “What I see in the two coaches that head up are two major sports, is an illusion….They act like head coaches…They command microphones and podiums very adequately….They have the gift of one-way gab ….They appear to be plenty capable to work as ESPN analysts….Tons of experience…Great players to hang their hats on….Association with programs that had/have great tradition…
    But does that make a great coach? Not many coaches can assemble a wining product even if granted all the winning separate parts…..Assembly is required…And few are rarely gifted to make everyone part of that assembly”

    At the end of the day, I do wholeheartedly agree with Tsao….Even when you, Podunker, are making positive comments about Wilson, it always feels like posturing…..You are a doubt seed. You’ll always be a doubt seed… . There’s always a snidely edge to your so-called support. And that’s what it was with Mallory…It was snidely through and through…Pin a big medal on your chest for your initial snidely stance lining up with who had to be the fall guy for another Hoosier fall guy day….Now you have your sights set on Wilson….What wonderful support…It doesn’t matter if the end result happens to coincidentally align with your original opinion…..It’s the processes used that sells what you are. You’re not terrorizing Hoosier support…Terror causes those not strong to have fear. I don’t fear anything you convey…You’re just empty of faith.

  63. murfman,
    I am quite certain you knew of the old news. But what was wrong with post #56 is you failed to consider the value of the old news to make that post smarter. In other words the U of L FB program offered decades of positives benefiting Strong’s success. Something IU still can’t offer its head FB coach. Quite frankly Wilson’s job at Bloomington is only about half complete. AD Glass understands that. As to the alarming things you say you observe, please project.

  64. TTG, The facts and thoughts in post #73 are well developed and blended together. L’ville’s big accomplishment was recognition of their situation. The Ville’s large local alumni base then took hold. Something IU’s alumni base in Indy does at times. IU’s future does look bright but I do not know what the hell positions PUke as there is nothing there to project it.

    I have never been a big proponent of mass public transportation but I always felt some commuter (rail) system from the Indy area to the IU campus would work famously for IU, Indy and the locale. I believe there was something like that “back in the old days”.

  65. HC. If you go back to sometime in the 1940’s, a train/trolley did run to Indy from Martinsville. Reading a story the other day, price for the trip went from ten cents a ride to 15 cents. (Could have been .15 to .20, Somewhere around there.) IU students boycotted the price increase and the service was discontinued. But I agree with you, passenger rail service could be big. Be great for IU fans from the Indy area.

  66. And HH. Back in post #57, or somewhere around there, you mentioned recruitment difficulty. To add to one of the themes you often address. Per the Indy Star, Hoosier state high school kids , 148 of them are playing BB at 71 division one schools.

  67. HforH; “At the end of the day, I do wholeheartedly agree with Tsao….Even when you, Podunker, are making positive comments about Wilson, it always feels like posturing…..You are a doubt seed.”

    Harvard, do you possess the self-awareness necessary to realize the profound hypocrisy and the irony exhibited by your comments in post #76? It’s one of the few posts of yours that I’ve read in quite a while, so maybe I’m just out of touch, but for someone with such a “sharp mind,” your lack of self awareness and your incredible hypocrisy made me laugh out loud. Pick almost any post you’ve ever written about Tom Crean and it’s hard to find anything positive at all. You despise the man for his style and faith no less, and your disdain for Crean has either made you delusional, or exposed your delusions, in the obsessive criticism and continuous attacks you post about the man (I suspect that even mentioning Crean in this post will send you off on another anti-Crean rant). And he’s been a lot more successful at IU than Wilson has been! And yet you just keep drinking the cool aid mixed up by your comrade.

    I’m not all in or all out on any person in a position of authority. I try to remain objective and analyze a coach’s performance, based on available facts and less-than-complete information. I’m stating my opinion, not trying to mount any seditious campaign (that ridiculous accusation is the funniest of them all). Yes, I have doubt about Wilson. How can any rational person, with any amount of objectivity, not have doubt about a coach that is in the midst of his fourth consecutive losing season and who has yet to produce a winning season as a head coach? If you don’t have doubt, you’re either not paying attention, you don’t care, you’re an idiot, a fool, or a member of the man’s immediate family. But having doubts does not mean, as I have been accused by your sidekick, that I don’t support Wilson. I do support him, and have since he arrived in Bloomington. I was supporting him early on when people were spreading rumors on this blog about him being drunk and abusive to a Resident Assistant in an IU dorm! I had doubt about the accuracy of the accusations being thrown at him back then. But until Wilson proves he is capable of leading IU football to a winning season, how can any rational fan not have doubts? The man had never been a head coach before arriving in Bloomington! Have you ever even heard that tried and true old axiom, “the best indication of a person’s future performance/behavior is the person’s past performance/behavior.” Until he produces a winning season, of course their will be doubt about Wilson’s ability, as a head coach, to make IU a winner. He’s never done it before! But I hope he does it in the next two years. I’m rooting for him to produce a winning season and will support him getting a big fat raise and contract extension if he is successful (and my support also comes in the form of checks written to IU). But if Wilson does not lead IU to a winning season, after six years as a head coach, I think any Athletic Director in his right mind would have to conclude that it would be time for IU to look for another man who might be capable of achieving better results for the glory of old IU. Thanks again for the laugh and for reminding me that occasionally, your comments are priceless.

  68. …..who has yet to produce a winning season as a head coach?

    Clarence Childs 1914-1915 2 6–7–1 .464 2–7 .
    Ewald O. Stiehm 1916-1921 5 20–18–1 .526 5–10–1 .
    James P. Herron 1922 1 1–4–2 .286 0–2–1
    Bill Ingram 1923-1925 3 10–12–1 .457 3–8–1 .
    Harlan Page 1926-1930 5 14–23–3 . 388 5–16–2 .
    Earle C. Hayes 1931-1933 3 8–14–4 .385 0–3
    Bo McMillin 1934-1947 14 63–48–11 .561 34–34–6
    Clyde Smith 1948-1951 4 8–27–1 .236 4–19
    Bernie Crimmins 1952-1956 5 13–32 .289 6–24
    Bob Hicks 1957 1 1–8 .111 0–6
    Phil Dickens 1958-1964 7 20–41–2 .333 8–27–2
    John Pont 1965-1972 8 31–51–1 .380 21–36–1 .
    Lee Corso 1973-1982 10 41–68–2 .378 28–52–2 .
    Sam Wyche 1983 1 3–8 . 273 2–7
    Bill Mallory 1984-1996 13 69–77–3 .473 39–65–1 .
    Cam Cameron 1997-2001 5 18–37 .327 12–28 .
    Gerry DiNardo 2002-2004 3 8–27 .229 3–21
    Terry Hoeppner 2005-2006 2 9–14 .391 4–12
    Bill Lynch 2007-2010 4 19–30 .388 6–26
    Kevin Wilson 2011–present 3 10–26

    Since the year 1900, there has been ONE Hoosier football coach that managed to coach the Hoosiers to a .500 career conference record….That coach was BoMcMillin.

    Since the Titanic sunk in 1914, there have been three coaches to manage a better than .500 overall record….The last coach to maintain a higher than .500 overall record was , confidently, also BoMcMillin…That great feat occurred in the years 1934-1947. I think we had a war go on during a large chunk of those years….My father had scholarships to play at Michigan or Purdue….He went off to fight in WW II instead…..No to take anything away from Bo, but my old man was one of the best tight ends in the state…If my old man would have gone to Michigan………I’m thinking he could have impacted at least one game against Indiana enough to push Bo below .500. It was a time of a rather important war….Football wasn’t really on the nation’s mind…..Again, not taking anything away from Bo.

    Go ahead, change coaches again……It’s done a ton over the 100+ years of IU Football. It’s the only change that really keeps us all rather delusional and hopeful….Another coach boards a plane….Another arrives…One leaves, one comes….One leaves, one comes…One leaves, one comes…..The airstrip stays busy…Do you honestly believe that I don’t understand what’s up against Kevin Wilson? He is up against the iceberg that sunk the Titanic….He is up against doubt that makes your doubt look like a pimple on a Pomegranate.. Do your really think that anyone hear believes were not just going to be in the same 100 year rerun we’ve always been in since our maiden Big 10 voyage? . We are all delusional, Podunker.. Those that cheer in the stands and leave at halftime can all be part of one giant hypocrisy club.we simply over as grief in form of warped entertainment…..Now we have a coach that doesn’t want to listen to such grief…..He’ll learn…He’ll learn that the Podunker’s drift in the North Atlantic in the dark night…..He’ll learn, indeed.

    Speaking of boarding planes and airstrips, as far as Tom Crean goes…..I’ve made up my mind that he’s taken “because it’s Indiana” to new heights….I’ve come to accept that sometimes men will never be changed…..Faith becomes the only cause….It takes over to the point that criticism will not stop a man in control of his own destiny .

  69. correction:

    Since the Titanic sunk in 1914, there have been three coaches to manage a better than .500 overall record….The last coach to maintain a higher than .500 overall record was , [coincidentally], also BoMcMillin…

  70. Seahawk Tom has sure disappeared….along with Russell Wilson and the Seahawks, I guess.

    Fire Pete Carroll now!!

  71. Nice slight-of-hand, Harvard. Who’s talking about “a .500 career conference record,” or “a better than .500 overall record.” Most of us would just like to see a winning season once in a while. Specifically, pertaining to the discussion that was taking place, we’re just talking about IU’s current coach proving he can achieve one winning season before IU extends his contract. No one is talking about an IU coach establishing a career winning record at IU. I guess that when you can’t win the debate, you feel the need to change the topic. Nice try.

    And a piece of the data you put forth above actually fortifies one of the points I made in justifying why it is not unreasonable for any IU fan to have doubt about Wilson based on his lack of experience as a head coach. Bo McMillin was a proven winner as a head coach before being hired by IU. And a few other points for you to ponder. Using statistic analysis born in realism, it is highly unlikely that Wilson will ever generate enough wins at IU, or anywhere else, to ever establish a better than .500 winning record as a head coach. Given his start at IU, he does not have enough years of coaching left to achieve that. But IU fans don’t care about that. We just want him to establish IU football as a regularly competitive team in the Big Ten. And furthermore, I believe most IU fans, myself included, would support Wilson being generously rewarded for leading IU football to that level of success.

    Last point, given that IU has such a dismal record of hiring (or supporting) head football coaches as the data you supplied indicates, why would IU choose to continue that pattern? Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is a sign of insanity. Your data suggests that IU football would be much better served if, in the future, whenever Wilson leaves IU, the Athletic Director hires a coach that has a winning record, or at least one that has proven his ability to lead his program to a winning season. I suggest that if IU were to do that, that new coach would inspire greater confidence and less doubt about IU football’s ability to ascend to where all Iu fans want the program to be.

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