IU skid extends to four in 74-62 loss to Purdue

Because of all that had transpired in Simon Skjodt Assembly Hall that day, there was no escaping the topic.

Indiana coach Archie Miller was going to be answering questions about his predecessor in Saturday’s postgame press conference.

When did he hear Bob Knight would return to his old stomping ground? What was his reaction? Did he talk to the old coach, who was making his first appearance at Assembly Hall since his firing in 2000? Does he think about occupying the same position as a basketball legend?

With respect, Miller acknowledged the significance of the event. “It means a lot to a lot of people,” he said, expressing a hope that this reunion would better tie the program’s past and future. As far as following a man like Knight as a coach at IU, Miller responded dryly, “I know Coach Knight was a coach here.”

After a 74-62 loss to Purdue, there wasn’t a jubilant tone to be had as a celebration of IU’s past mixed with a hard reminder of the Hoosiers’ present. Four games into a losing streak, outworked and out-executed by an in-state rival, IU found itself at at a crossroads.

A team that has prided itself on strength inside was, for the second game in a row, out-rebounded. A team that has been so much better at home than on the road couldn’t muster a triumphant moment in Knight’s return, fumbling the ball away at inopportune times.

The topic turned to Knight once again, and Miller was asked what made his predecessor’s teams so special. His mind settled on “role definition,” believing “The General” had a way of getting his players to find their purpose and execute.

That’s not the Hoosiers right now.

“As a coach, I think that’s what you’re looking for the most is to develop that belief in one another where guys believe in each other,” Miller said. “And, at times, you can see that our team has played well and at times clearly we haven’t. But there’s a lot of ball left to be played.

“And the Big Ten is so difficult, every night is an opportunity for a great win.”

Unfortunately, IU (15-8, 5-7 Big Ten) squandered a golden opportunity on Saturday. Following a loss to an in-state rival, the Hoosiers have one more opportunity at home, versus Iowa on Thursday, before they swing to the road in four out of their next five contests.

Pregame, Knight took a moment to talk to the Hoosiers. He told them to play hard.

“Which I thought we played really hard,” said freshman Trayce Jackson-Davis, who led his team with 16 points and eight rebounds.

“Just not the outcome we wanted,” the 6-foot-9 forward continued. “He’s a legend. He’s the reason why people talk about IU basketball, really.”

Saturday’s halftime moment was cathartic for Hoosier fans that wanted old wounds healed, but what ails this current team still needs fixing.

Purdue (14-10, 7-6) held an 11-1 advantage in fastbreak points. The Boilermakers’ bench outscored the Hoosier contingent 33-17. In the paint — again, a supposed strength for IU — the visitors had 28 points to the Hoosiers’ 20.

It wasn’t a struggle throughout. IU held a 28-25 lead over its rival with 3:47 left in the first half. But heading into the locker room, the Boilermakers went on a 12-0 run.

The Hoosiers fought back in the second half, drawing to within 56-50 with nine minutes remaining. That brought the volume back to halftime levels, as the IU faithful badly wanted a victory to mark the occasion.

But that’s when Matt Haarms scored two buckets, the second ripping through a Justin Smith foul for an and-1. Out of the time out, he sank the free throw, 61-50, which dropped the volume in Assembly Hall down to almost nothing.

“Was able to knock that down and kind of just took the air out of the run,” Miller said. “But no question about it, the turnovers continue to be a problem. And it’s not like you’re not talking about them, but you’ve got to continue to work through it and get better.”

Looking at the stat sheet, seeing that Purdue won the rebounding battle, 29-28, only added to the discontent.

“They’re the No. 1 offensive rebounding team in the league. They do it for a reason,” Miller said, crediting Purdue. “At one point it was a strength of ours. Right now it’s not.

“If you just say, ‘Hey, how do you get better?’ Rebound the ball better and take care of it. We’re a better team. That’s what it’s going to come down to.”

Right now, the Hoosiers just aren’t there.

And the Hoosiers’ third-year coach knows the buck stops with him.

“I’m disappointed for our players. I’m disappointed for our fans. I’m disappointed for everyone that came back for the reunion,” Miller said. “And I’ll take full responsibility on the loss today.”


  1. I teared up when Gene was shown clapping. As for the program, Glass has at least one more hire to make.

    1. I don’t buy that argument at all. There is something going bad wrong with this team. It is the same team which beat FSU, but can’t beat PU? Not sure what or where it is, but it something has destroyed this team’s chemistry.

      1. I think if you follow the signs down the hall to the head coaches office, you might find it there.

  2. I did not tear up, and neither did our crowd. You cannot script everything, and the reaction of the crowd to this old man tottering was palpable. Do not mis-understand me, we will ALL be tottering in our last years. But that was not the Hero they were promised, and they did not know what to do, until directed by the (1980) players to cheer, and, to the crowd’s credit, cheer they did for the Icon.

    No, I did not tear up. But I WAS sad. It is always sad to see a towering figure in his last days.

    Thank you, Bob Knight, for all that you did for our University, and State.

    Memories, of what we were….Memories of who we were. No longer that. Something else now.

    As for this team, I’ve officially given up on them. NO fire, NO enthusiasm, NO hustle, NOTHING.

    N.I.T. is where this team belongs, and I won’t be watching that tournament.

  3. thinkaboutit, you hit the nail on the hammer.

    Jackson-Davis is mailing it in and will be gone next year.

    This group of players truly hates playing on the same team with each other (once again we get to watch this) and the next games in the Big Ten Season are going to be fascinating, because other teams are coming together as we are falling apart.


    1. TJD is coming back. Just announced today.

      He wasn’t the problem. Him and Hunter were the only ones who played hard and wanted to be there. The rest of this team just wilted.

  4. I’m wiped out watching this team. Garbage basketball. Absolute garbage. The most disturbing thing was NO HEART.

    This team was meandering through their sets. No rhythm. The lanes are constantly clogged because no one is cutting hard. Everything is contested. We threw the ball away 10 times in the half-court by just throwing the ball away. We have the worst backcourt in the history of our program.

    They had an ENTIRE WEEK to prepare for this game and they just fell down looking up for their mommies to pick them up. Instead they got a giant P right on their face from the bottom of Purdue’s Nikes.

    How on earth can this team NOT get up for this game? So many Hoosiers who have accomplished something there.

  5. Thank you Coach Knight for coming home.

    Thank you for decorating Assembly Hall in banners.

    I hope this program someday returns to that excellence. I’ve NEVER felt so far away from that goal. But for 10 minutes today, I was reminded of what it did feel like and why.

  6. Simply pathetic effort resulting in pathetic basketball. We were schooled today on our home court by our largest rival. Our team was simple ABSENT. When shots go down teams look pretty good, but aside from that we were absolutely clueless today on both ends. And we got outhustled.

    For the life of me, I cannot understand why Green is out there, especially when his garbage isn’t going down. He is a complete liability elsewhere.

    Same old things, same old themes that have cost this team all season;
    Poor movement + Poor guard play + Poor shooting + Bonehead turnovers = No offensive rhythm

    Purdue had us scouted very well. They were in our offensive sets & motions before we were. ALL day long. They jumped screens & were very disciplined about who to guard & who to slough on. I give them a lot of credit for knowing us better than we do. Clearly!

    Which means this coaching staff got schooled as well. Make no bones about it. When things are going S, as a coach you have to change the game. Whether that is with a major lineup adjustment, change of defense (ex. to zone), full court pressure, hard fouls, etc…. something must CHANGE! What is most troubling is that we had 1 full week to scout them, rest & build a plan. And yet this is the result?!?!

    5-7 is a lot worse than 6-6, particularly with this 4 out of 5 road stretch coming starting next Sun. Reminds me a lot of last year. A lot of teasing with surprising out of nowhere wins, only to be more than offset by bad losses. I harken back to the Ark. game as the first indication of what could go wrong. That game painted this picture of hell we’re currently mired in.

  7. IF TJD is gone next year it will be transfer …Archie cannot generate any passion…when he does his POST game speeches it like sleeping pills in a red sweater. With CAM’s laid back managerial style ..you’re left with Devonte playing HERO BALL to be the leader. I REALLY never believed Archie should be fire but given his time to develop..What I saw today he couldn’t start a wildfire in dry brush and breeze blowing at his back.. He wouldn’t allow the player to see Knight’s return or hear it; maybe he should have Archie would have seen PASSION for IU Basketball on Knight’s face. Terribly disappointed with Miller..I don’t think he will EVER HAVE the PASSION and FIRE. Its gonna be …: Well OK do the best you can” or can you try harder , PLEASE” Someone needs to put a fire under Archie’s asss since he cant get it under the players.

  8. Double Down used the same words that I had; Garbage Basketball! This game was garbage, and to think they played this bad at home against their in-state rivals. Absolutely pathetic!

    What a contrast to see men like Buckner, May, Thomas, etc. on the court again and then to watch this IU team play the second half.

    I think it’s time to acknowledge that Archie is failing. This team is clearly not improving and now they’re not even playing hard or with any passion. In fact, I think they’re getting worse. They look absolutely lost on the court. You can talk about Crean’s remaining recruits until the cows come home; you can say “wait until next years recruits arrive” until you’re blue in the face; you can talk about the affect of past injuries until your eyes cross, but there is no excuse for the way this team is playing. This team simply does not pass the eye test for the most educated basketball fan base in the country. This team is just terrible, and Archie is responsible.

    This season is over. IU does not deserve to go to the NCAA tournament. This team can’t even defend its home court in spite of amazing fan support. And if TJD departs for the NBA this spring, next season will be a bust too. With every additional garbage performance like today’s debacle, Archie’s job security becomes more and more tenuous. I believe the new AD’s first priority will be to begin evaluating candidates to replace Archie, because IMO, in 13 months Archie will have run out of excuses.

  9. After reading everyone’s comments, ‘no passion’, ‘wouldn’t let players see Knight’s return’, ‘turnovers’, ‘no passion’, ‘team chemistry’, ‘shooting’, ‘mailing it in’, ‘leaving’!!!!
    Most everyone ‘isn’t buying it’? Really now? How much more do you need to see?
    ANY COACH that would allow this performance at home with this backdrop, 3 losses in a row coming in + a national TV featured audience is beyond expendable. He and his band of neer’ do wells are an embarrassment. Adios Archie! This outfit is worse than the Jerry Oliver crew in 1969.

  10. It was great to see Coach Knight return to Assembly Hall today, yes the affects of getting old were apparent, I can understand I’m just three years younger than Coach Knight. I watched the game just for the chance that Coach Knight would return to Assembly Hall and there were a lot of fans and his former players that really welcomed his return to I U Basketball. ESPN. was saved today by his return, could fill the second half of the game with Coach Knight memories and let the game play out. When you get into your late seventies there are some days that you forget to wear your Superman’s outfit and just appear just as an old man, that you are.

  11. When watching Archie during press conferences, other media interviews and when he’s giving speeches, I sometimes wonder if he’s on the Autism Spectrum? I’m not a psychiatrist, but I would not be surprised to learn that he is mildly autistic or is on medication that diminishes his emotional wavelength. He seems intelligent and is obviously a high functioning individual, but I can’t remember ever seeing him happy and joyful, or angry. He’s the least passionate college basketball coach I’ve ever watched and I can’t recall ever seeing a coach with less public emotion. They say players will take on the personality of their coach. If that has happened with this group it could explain a few things.

  12. Archie won’t be fired! In my opinion, he will be given 2 more years. If no improvement, then he is gone. That way, the Crean cycle will be over, because right now that is Archie’s insurance policy. The problem is, how does he recruit top players with the results he has been getting? Hopefully, he has a magic plan, because he needs a miracle. Today was a total embarrassment! Archie and IU looked totally overmatched. Anytime you have out of control players like Durham, Green, DD and Smith on the court, what should we really expect. Hunter looks like he can shoot, but he can’t dribble or pass. Thompson is good for a few rebounds and that is about it. Phinisee, at best, should be a back up guard, and Brunk a good, tough minutes guy off the bench. TJD is your only player and other than that, the cupboard is bare. Archie, good luck, you are going to need it.

  13. Goodnight, sleep tight.
    Do a little wrong, do a lot of right,
    Doesn’t matter for the days
    Soon turn shorter to a clock full of spite.
    They’ll parade you out
    One final sideshow these ending hours
    You’ve lost all your will
    You’ve lost all your might
    Shallowest of hearts pretend contrite
    Movers and shakers come out from shadows
    Gawk upon your dwindled wit and surrendered fight.
    A halftime ..a summation…a pocket fisherman tribute
    A concise review of your life packaged
    Eyes stare upon you from their own youth immortal
    We’ll slap some resignation on your old sorry rear.
    Did you do it all for this half-ass final cheer?
    A few more words to close the coffin tight.
    Goodnight. Sleep tight, My Basketball General
    The man I just saw was not Bobby Knight.

  14. What a day to post a first comment, but here I go. I was at IU in the late ’70’s, and seeing Bobby in Assembly Hall actually brought back a flood of memories. He was only in his late 30’s in those days, hard to see him looking as infirm as he did today. But it happens to all of us at some point. The other takeaway from today is how terrible this year’s team has become. Unbelievable. I watch as many games as I can at a sports bar with other IU alums and the waitress actually watches the game, knowing that when #11 comes off the bench I will need a stiff bracer to stay calm. I thought Crean’s tenure was weird but this is more painful to watch. I was going to try to be more articulate but a certain sports reporter at an Indianapolis newspaper said it for me. “They’d seen a rousing start give way to an alarmingly familiar performance. Poor offense leading to poor defense, leading to low energy, leading to bad rebounding, leading to easy runs the other way. Leading to losses, now four of them in a row.”
    Thanks Zach, That sums it up for me.

  15. It was good to see Coach Knight today. I was at IU in the 70’s and enjoyed the skill, determination and will to win in those teams. I learnt from Coach Knight to do your best all the time and be skillful at my job. I like what Randy Wittman said (if I may paraphrase). I came in a kid and left a man. That is not happening today.

    Coach Miller said he takes full responsibility. Coach you say that all the time. You say you will go a different path, but nothing changes. Honestly Coach, it doesn’t seem honest any more.

    I wholeheartedly agree with Podunker regarding the lack of emotion Archie Miller shows. No matter what you do in your life you have to have passion. I feel as if I am listening to a funeral durge.

  16. Hoosier Hopeful, it could be dangerous to the future of IU BB to keep Archie for a fifth season if next year’s team continues this type of performance. IMO, if next year’s team is a bad as the current team, or if it fails to produce significantly more wins (i.e., > 22 wins), I don’t think IU can afford to keep Archie for a fifth season. He’d be a lame duck, and that would make recruiting elite players almost impossible. And having a weak roster with no players in the pipeline makes hiring a really good coach all the more difficult.

    So another bad season could place IU between a rock and a hard place. On one hand, IU’s Administration and BOT does not want to buy out the last year of Archie’s contract. But it can’t afford to allow the program to slide further away from mediocracy. By then, we’ll have a new AD and a new President, and they’ll be judged in large part by how the BB program performs. And let’s be honest. IU is no longer able to pay top-dollar to hire a BB coach, especially if they have to pay to buy out his predecessor’s contract. I’d say $4 million per year is the ceiling for IU’s head BB coach. So we’re looking at another “up-and-comer” type head coach. And there are going to be several other quality coaching positions opening up in the next three seasons that could be seen as being more attractive coaching jobs than IU. The IU BB program is in trouble and another season like this one, especially if recruiting declines further, is going to make the IU coaching job even less appealing to a really good, ambitious coach.

  17. The joy of watching IU basketball is completely gone. I feel like it is just something I have to get through out of obligation.

    I’m officially off the Archie wagon. Three years in and this is what the program is. Sub-mediocre level basketball with month long losing streaks. We’re 12th in the Big Ten right now. Penn State and Rutgers are both looking like they will play in March. Our team doesn’t look like they want to play another game.

    My malaise is twenty-five years of accumulation. I just can’t stand it anymore. I hope Archie turns it around, but I’m not betting on it. I think we’re looking at another couple of dead seasons of “next year” regardless of who the coach is at best.

    Looking at all the greats on the floor today was so wonderful. They produced a lot of hardware for the trophy cases. But looking to the future, it doesn’t look like we’ll be adding anything other empty seats.

  18. 1) CaliHoosier wins todays comment award. 2) Nothing could adequately explain the game today – so I’ll skip that 3) Drove a 13 yr old home after his game & he was PO’ed. He hit seven 3s in the first half. When a player gets 20 points he can still play, but any additional points by him will not count.? That is just wrong.

  19. The headlines Sunday will be the Purdue win. The Saturday news — Purdue sponsoring a seminar for the community ‘How to identify & report sex trafficking’ and ”building the worlds first Mach 8 wind tunnel’. IU was sponsoring a ‘sexual exploration’ program.

  20. Had time to cool off and reflect on today’s fiasco. I can only think of a few possibilities to explain this team. We can’t say there is no talent, not with the wins they have both this year and last year. That cuts down the explanations to just a few.

    Either this team has a severe case of locker room poison or CAM is in over his head. As bad as this is, there is a possible 3rd explanation, it could be both. We saw this in the latter years of TLC’s run and it appears to be showing up again.

  21. Glass is retiring at the right time, but he’s leaving a problem for his successor to fix.

    How much is Texas Tech paying their coach now?

  22. I compare Indiana to the titanic. It’s beyond repair. This team is sinking fast and better find out where the life preservers are. Archie Miller is a bum. What a greasy hair joke.

  23. My prediction for the rest of 2020. IU bball fails to make NCAA, again. Gets beat in the first round of NIT. New AD comes in right before end of school year. IU baseball makes it to Super Regional, but comes up slightly short of a trip to Omaha, but new AD extends baseball coach. Immediately after that gives Coach Moren her deserved extension. Then the new AD sits down with Archie and lets him know that it is NCAA or bust next year. That seat will be very hot. He then sits down TA and lets him know that he would like a win versus the Big 3 in the East (OSU, MU or PSU) and a bowl game or the football program coaching staff will need to be evaluated starting at the top. Again, this is just guesses, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see some of this.

    1. I wouldn’t be surprised. I’d be shocked because I don’t think that would be the edict to the AD from above.

  24. iuhoosier92, I doubt any new AD is going to warn TA that his coaching staff will be evaluated unless IU beats one of the Big Three and/or goes to another bowl game in 2020. TA is as bullet proof as any IU coach can be right now, and I’m sure McRobbie will convey that to the new AD before he begins his duties as IU’s new AD.

    What interests me is who IU’s next President is going to be and how “invested” that man or women will be in IU Athletics. A lot of people close to IU’s Senior Administration and BOT have been griping about the perceived gap between Purdue and IU, and that such gap has been widening during McRobbie’s tenure. And per Ron’s comments above, they’re not just talking about Athletics.

  25. Great opinion piece today by Mike Schumann published in The Dailey Hoosier. He nails it, and I suggest everyone read it.

  26. I read it….Yawn.

    Nothing can be gauged until the holdovers are gone. Our new coach is straightjacketed by Glass’s Bill of Rights’ and the depths of how much local recruiting had fallen off.

    Because there is no “witch” to run out of town, some want to assume what Archie inherited is better than what Crean inherited. In many respects it’s worse…because some holdovers seemingly have zero investment and sabotage the efforts of the new recruits. That lack of investment is a virus ….with no anecdote other than graduation or removal from the team. Benching does not stop the virus. No coach can make a kid invested who does not want to be. The coach has no ‘Bill of Rights’ in these circumstances.

    Some columnists are pointing out a lot of “obvious” observations in poor play while rather disingenuously failing to point out the challenges of broken rosters vs. operating with clean slate. And many of those inherited “holdovers” with little future beyond college basketball may act differently under the scenario of their last beloved coach retired…vs. a beloved coach fired.

    The true rebuilding begins after next season. But I doubt the fan base will be patient. It’s all fine. There are many qualified coaches who will happily take an opportunity to make millions at Indiana. Coaches make so damn much money, it’s there for the grabbing whether they are truly invested or not. They’ll go through the motions….and play the game. The better the salesman, preacher, or “actor.” the more some will buy in. Expertise have very little to do with anything anymore. Kansas threw money at a recruit and he still plays. Then he got involved in a brawl…and he’ll still be allowed to play in March Madness.

    Let’s be realistic here…All of college basketball is a sh__show. Indiana may be labeled as irrelevant by those paid to make our circumstances their 24/7 peach basket soap opera, but they fail on the commentary of how the cards are becoming more and more stacked in favor a very few. Our health or lack thereof will still have to come back to a very fixed game (recruiting, NCAA oversight, fairness in penalties for violators).

    Even with zero dysfunction and a perfect coach, we will operate in an underdog status for a very long time. The game will soon be at the mercy of online gambling as well….Enjoy what you can of the basketball struggles because “relevancy” has nothing to do with it. Archie is a dying breed…and he’ll not survive a game having no room for an unpretentious man not built to be a clown or a cheat.

  27. After watching an ALMOST 80 y/o man with a clinched fist pumping and demonstrating a passion that hasn’t been seen on the sidelines of Mc Cracken Court in 20 yrs. I heard say that a Team reflects the personality of its coach. CAM what’s needed is PASSION and NOT NEEDED is the “Golly, gee whilligers the other team gets credit for playing good” HEY ARCHIE NEWS FLASH..THEY”RE SUPPOSE TO PLAY GOOD.

  28. TJ, I agree with your post, but remember, a zebra can’t change its stripes!

    I’m not sure Archie’s personality allows him to express the kind of passion you reference. It’s kind of strange, especially when you watch his older brother coach at AZ. That man is passionate during games. Maybe Archie embraces the culture that suggests that yelling at young adults is counter-productive because it makes them feel bad?

  29. There’s no bad teams, just bad leaders.

    If someone isn’t getting results, the people at the top are the ones responsible.

    I’m not calling Archie a bad leader. I’m saying that the excuse that the fault lies with cancerous players is blame shifting. It is the responsibility of the leader to give them the opportunity to change, or send them packing. That’s ownership. You can blame “kids today,” and realize that in 2020, just like in 1976, at the end of the year, one team holds up the trophy at the end of the tournament. Someone is going to win and it is the leader’s responsibility to own every part of his program’s heading. You own the environment you have to operate in as well as people who you bring in to execute your vision.

    I don’t think there are many easy answers in fixing Indiana basketball. I think there’s a component of truth in everything people have said over the years and recently that contribute to why Indiana basketball is flailing.

    The reason I had/have hope, is that it seems like Archie has completely owned his failures. I don’t see a man running or deflecting. But that’s only in press conferences. I have no idea what’s going on behind the scenes.

    What I do see with Archie is a stubborn lack of flexibility in his strategy to adjust to his roster’s weaknesses and strengths. I can relate to that. I ran my own company for 10 years and the first 5 was doggedly sticking to a strategy that wasn’t quite working. I would have saved a few hairs on my head, a lot of sleepless nights and major relief on my bank account if I had put my ego aside and been open to different approaches. But I owned my failure, changed my mindset and things dramatically shifted.

    Be skeptical of any keyboard warrior that thinks there are easy fixes to Indiana Basketball. But that doesn’t matter, because there’s only one person who is responsible to change things and that’s Archie Miller. He’s getting paid a lot of money to do so. He has all the tools, money and support he needs to get the job done.

    I don’t really have a clear picture of HOW that is going to happen exactly. I just see the same results: sub-mediocre basketball, major losing streaks and perhaps an unprecedented 4th year in a row of sub .500 conference finish, which hasn’t happened since WWI. This is unacceptable. Full stop

  30. He was the coach of Dayton….We probably need to let that sink in. We couldn’t even nail down a coach from Butler. Is what it is…I suppose we could have done far worse. I never expected miracles from this hire…nor did I necessarily have to have big results in the immediacy.

    But no coach can fix certain guys….There are players on this roster who are marvelous athletes while being relatively average basketball players. We’d like to think a coaching staff could change those things, but sometimes(whether you own it, or don’t own it) those changes are not realistic in a few college seasons where off-season is restricted and practices confined to what’s realistic alongside the travel and studies required of a “student-athlete.”

    I was never overly impressed with any of the recruits Archie inherited (outside of the potential I thought present in Justin Smith). My impressions three years in remain about the same.
    Romeo leaving after one season was also a sizable blow….I don’t advocate listening to Dakich, but today I tuned him in for a brief 30 minutes or so….Dakich spoke a bit of Romeo and his assessment of just how lost in basketball IQ Romeo appears to be at the pro level is beyond troubling. It’s troubling because it says something about priorities at the high school level b-ball teachings he received…and it’s troubling because he still didn’t come away with much gains from spending one season with IU and Archie.

    We’ve all been in classrooms where a few believe their intelligence or further value is beyond anything a teacher can offer….If you have raw talent, I simply believe some believe they can “wing it” …and they’re simply punching their college time card until they take their supreme athleticism to the next level. I don’t know how you force someone to want to learn …or get them to want to play the game with a team first mentality. It’s probably difficult enough with your own recruits….

    It’s taken Pat Chambers almost a decade….Fast fixes just don’t cut it anymore. Simply because we have five banners doesn’t mean crap to most young recruits. I think most of that died with Jordy Hulls.

  31. I saw a good program this morning “Colin Cowherd”..now Im not Even remotely a follower of his or his program, BUT he did raise a point about NBA teams ( and I don’t watch the NBA either) What was discussed was “Team composition”. The shooter, the rim protector, the director, the defender. I was thinking Does “Stars” matter with team composition? can you get a good composition recruiting 3 stars or lower? Kind of addresses your observation H4H. Cowherd addressed the team that has Westbrook; saying he isn’t a good 3 pt shooter and team had 2 “cloggers”(clogged the lane) offense was anemic at best; and DD that goes to your inflexibility.

    1. TJ, yeah, that’s a good point. Here’s a great thread by Tony Adragna. I love reading that guy. He’s levelheaded, a huge Hoosier fan and has a really deep understanding of the Xs and Os.


      From my point of view, Archie seems inflexible in sticking with the 2 Bigs (Brunk & TJD). While those are two of our better players, that line-up causes all kinds of issues with our weak guard play. Wanna see a stat that will make you barf up your lunch? Indiana is only scoring .79 points per possession when playing through the post. OUCH!

      Another stat that you won’t be surprised at: we are scoring .62 PPP off the dribble. We don’t have anyone who can create their own shot.

      So, what’s the solution? Do you remember how we made a nice little run in the 2nd half when we went to our “smaller” line-up. We cut Purdue’s lead down to 6.

      I think Jerome Hunter is our key. Surprisingly, we’ve had some success shooting the ball in spotting up. Instead of running the two bigs down low and working through the post, I would look to do a lot more drive and kick. I’d have Jerome Hunter at the 4 finding his way into the corner. I like the matchups he gets in the half-court when he’s able to find perimeter shots. But if Hunter is used down on the block, you’re playing right into the hands of their 4’s size and strength. And that’s where we always find him in the half court.

      That also spreads out the floor. Now we are able to play to the strengths of our guards. AD, AF and RP are much better at driving and scoring cutting through the lane than they are off the dribble.

      One of the other things that Tony mentioned, is that we are not creating enough opportunities to score in transition. He suggests because we can go 9 deep, that we try out some more pressure defense instead of sticking with the pack-line. I’m less sold on that. If our guys are having a hard enough time grasping one type of defense, adding in another style sounds like a recipe for an even bigger disaster. But at this stage, sitting at the bottom of the B1G, I would be open to anything.

      Complicating things, though, was one of the biggest failings Crean has a coach. He would complicate things so much that everything was always a jumbled mess. Players just didn’t know what was going on.

      Archie is too far in the other direction. He DOES understand the game of basketball really well. I just haven’t seen him allow for some flexibility from his system, when there are some glaring issues which stats back up. There is some hope, though. Wondering if what we’ll see in the upcoming 4-5 game stretch.

      1. Hey DD!
        Loved your comment, “I think Jerome Hunter is our key.” Please tell who has been spouting this ad nauseam? If CAM wants to turn this around, we need to see much more of JH, if he is able to respond (I hope, I hope, I hope).

  32. Harv, we’re close to the same page.

    Extreme ownership, though. Archie is responsible for dealing with the toxic personnel. If they don’t want to play hard, put in the film work, play within the frame of the team and the parameters set by their coach, it is the coaches responsibility to put in measures for them to correct themselves. Positive and negative. He’s done some of that. Green is seeing way less minutes. But I would have gone further, with his sulking attitude, I would have publicly stripped him of his captain title. Being a captain is earned. There should be broadly communicated standards of what it means to be a captain, and those expectations need to be met and exceeded every day. I haven’t seen one ounce of leadership from Green all year. I see it from TJD, Joey Brunk, Phinisee (at times),

    If those players don’t respond to those corrective behaviors, or they respond with more toxic behaviors, it is time to show those players the door.

    Pat Chambers took over the Indiana Football of Big Ten Basketball programs. PSU was just absolute garbage and their fanbase complete apathetic to it. He had 10 years because there’s no hot-seat there. He also bought some time while the PSU football program imploded in the worst scandal in sports history.

    Indiana Basketball is in a much different place. He has the largest budget in the B1G, packed home court, best practice facilities and a long line of great former players who are active and passionate about supporting the long-term success of the basketball program. Indiana University has all the advantages now that they didn’t have when the basketball program was funded with a shoestring budget in the mid-late 90’s, early oughts.

  33. Agree with you as well…But some players will do just enough to not be shown the door. And if they’re ‘sulking’ during a game, imagine how much dysfunction they can create away from Assembly?
    It’s a unique situation because the guy you identify as possibly needing stripped of his captain duties also has the biggest connections to basketball at the next level…So who has more influence/power with roster members? Is it the rather reserved instructor/coach…or is it the teammate who’s in the know and rubs shoulders with the NBA ‘movers and shakers?’

    The term I used a few weeks back was “respect.” I don’t know how you fix things when there’s no respect for the teacher. I don’t see Archie as someone who idolizes everything at the “next level” in this sport. I see him as a college coach first and foremost ….rather than a “Galileo” or a talent agent for those with the best raw individual gifts to make an NBA scout salivate. The power struggles and attempts for garnering respect for this level of basketball are far different than in Knight’s heyday. Knight was having more and more difficulty with the hands of the NBA in the college cookie jar….I think Archie may be fighting some of those same issues which erode respect for the college game (within his broken roster and the grander picture of changing times).

    Crean modeled himself as a conduit between a kid in college and his pursuit of the NBA….But Crean was nearly completely inept in managing a team. Archie may be the better teacher of the game, but he operates removed from the jargon and politicking many coaches use as a survival tactic in kissing up to the ultimate purpose of recruits with, primarily, NBA dreams.

    I think Archie owns the problems with the team…But how do you stop the influences of the NBA upon the game and how it all erodes at a simple man being respected enough to teach team basketball? Did we move to far from Crean on that spectrum…? Do kids want more from a coach who operates mostly for banners…or one who operates mostly to turn you into a lottery pick? We went very old school with Archie…That may work at a place like Dayton (or at Indiana in our heyday under Knight) but does it work at an audition stage like Indiana? Is Archie being perceived as too old-fashioned as he functions very removed from the “next level” constantly on the brain of the most highly talented players?

  34. What’s more important to a recruit when examining the next two statements?

    a) I want to go play for (fill in coach’s name) because he’s an excellent coach and he wants to return Indiana Basketball to its once great standards of excellence.

    b) I want to go play for (fill in coach’s name) because just look at how many recruits he found under the radar who are now making it in the NBA.

    There is your spectrum…Which is more important to a recruit arriving at Indiana as compared to one arriving at Dayton?

  35. Archie had tough questions but more Importantly some harsh criticisms at the Don Fischer Show tonight. One lady commented for past 2 years………. 2YEARS it seemed the team came out of the locker room FLAT. Another gentleman asked Archie how stubborn he was to being flexible. Listening to his answers I have no doubt Archie knows the score; he is really disappointed in the leadership and (I think the work ethic) away from organized practices and scheduled workout times. Archie is looking to add for next year from Transfers, Grad Trans, even overseas. I expect some to leave in spring ( My guess is DA being one). I expect Devonte is the toxic player but I also suspect Justin ‘cuz some games he into IT and some days he sleepwalks and that roller coaster ride isn’t any fun. I also have to wonder about RT sticking it out because of all the injuries.

  36. All of the AM excuse makers, cut it out, pleeease. Knight got rid of 5 guys in one fell swoop when he walked into the middle of a pot party. You’re either running the show or it’s running you. EVERYTHING we see on the floor is an extention of him. Like Schuman’s article points out, this is very possibly the worst 3 year run in the program’s history.
    Being bad is one thing. Playing without passion or meaning is another.

    1. Brad,
      The last time I looked, this ain’t 30 years ago. There are a lot of critics out there (some who never seem to have a positive word to say about anything) who seem to have never left those days. Whether we’ll admit it or not, CAM DOES have some major problems inherited from his predecessor. I also find it interesting that in recent days much as been made on many sites regarding IU’s bill of rights for athletes and how it constricts what CAM can do. I remember getting panned quite severely some time back when I raised the issue.

      The only thing I can say, is pay attention to what CAM is recruiting, not what this team is doing. The incoming class may not have the extra stars, but they do have the ingredients needed for a solid program.

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